Bang's Blogs: Dormammu vs Trigon

 

(Cabbage)

(Yuix)

(Gio)

(Stationsearcher)

(TheCardinalKing)

“The danger is that Satan is dimming our light so slowly that darkness turns normal.” - Neal A. Maxwell

Dormammu, the Dread.

Trigon, the Terrible.

Deep in the empty abyss of space, two of the cosmos’ darkest demonic kings rule their twisted dimensions with an iron fist, scheming with plots to lay waste to reality until all of creation is melted into a fiery pit. They will stop at nothing to tear down the dimensional barriers keeping them from unleashing hell onto the mortal plane. Will the Dark Dimension’s walls fall onto Dormammu, or is there no escape for the one they call Trigon? Know them, for all will be destroyed in this DEATH BATTLE! 

Before We Start…

Both will be given their mainline comic appearances, Earth-616 for Dormammu and Pre/Post-Flashpoint for Trigon, and any temporary amps will be noted as such.

Also, thank you guys for voting this blog for the Most Anticipated Blog of 2026.

Background

Dormammu

“'Tis I who now stand ready to snuff out the brief candle of your worthless life...I, Dormammu!”

Thousands of millions of years ago, a pair of twins were born in the dimension of the Faltine, a dimension where its denizens were born as pure magic. Defying Faltine tradition, these twins were rather rambunctious, gathering matter unto themselves and being responsible for the death of their father, Sinifer. Exiled, Umar and her brother continued to gather matter unto themselves, wandering dimensions until they stumbled upon the Dark Dimension and its many pocket universes. To them, this seemed like home. Amassing more matter to take more physical appearances, the twins would stumble upon a very important cycle taking place in the Dark Dimension. As it so happens, the Dark Dimension was ruled by the wizard-king Olnar the First, who reigned for 28,000 meaning 28 cycles of peace. Olnar welcomed the twins into his home, sensing the magic capabilities they possessed as Faltines, and offered power in exchange for the knowledge of breaking down dimensional barriers and absorbing more realms into the Dark Dimension.

The 29th cycle of King Olnar’s rule would continue on, and the twins would soon bring Olnar’s wish come true…only it led to disaster. Whether by chance or by design, the twins led Oldnar to the realm of the Mindless Ones, unstoppable creatures of pure destruction who killed Olnar and the citizens of the Dark Dimension. With their magic, the twins sealed away the Mindless Ones, sealing them away and saving what little remained of the Dark Dimension, which to the survivors, made them the new rulers of the Dark Dimension. The son of Olnar however, Orini, was still alive as an infant, though the twins took him under their care, seeing as he posed no threat. Trouble would strike when Umar would eventually have an affair with the now adult Orini, bearing a daughter named Clea, and Umar's brother used deception to banish Umar to a pocket dimension for her wrongdoings, while Orini raised the child in service of the brother. He is only known as the Dreaded One, a being bathed in the wretched flames and merged with the mystical energies of the Dark Dimension. The Lord of Chaos, he who comes from the outer dark, he is…Dormammu.

Trigon

“Resistance is futile to one who is the destroyer of all that exists!”

Long ago, a woman named Angela Roth sought more in life. But she did not crave adventure or excitement, what she truly craved was love. And so, it was given to her, but she could never know that what would transpire would change the course of the universe. Angela became involved with a cult who purposefully attempted to bring forth the devil, with Angela being the bride. What came forth was a beautiful man whom Angela became infatuated with, and soon she became pregnant with his child. It was then that this man of angelic beauty revealed his true form. It wasn't the Devil that they had summoned, but someone much much worse. He was a demon, and the personification of evil known as Trigon.

How could a demon worse than the Devil exist? It is said that hundreds of years ago, a group of humans abandoned life on Earth, becoming a sect of pacifists in an interdimensional world known as Azarath. Seeking to achieve total peace, these pacifists cast out all the dark passion from their souls in the nether-realms beyond the Great Door of Azarath. And while energy cannot be created nor destroyed, it can change. And the leftover evil energy lay in space, slowly forming into a physical being, just waiting to wreak havoc on the universe. An alien world would unfortunately and unknowingly summon this evil energy, impregnating a woman and giving birth to Trigon.

Trigon was relentless; destroying the people that gave him life as an infant, destroying his homeworld by age six, and conquering his dimension and millions of worlds as an adult. Many attempts were made by Trigon to continue his legacy through children, but many would not survive, and the women he impregnated knew of the threat they would pose and would kill them when they were infants. It wasn’t until Angela summoned him that something was going to work out. After giving Angela his seed he abandoned her and let Angela be taken in by the Azarathens, a group of interdimensional people who practiced pacifism. There, his child Raven would be born, who carried his dark power within her and would be safe from harm with the people of Azarath, ensuring Trigon's spawn would grow into a powerful ally to help him pierce the barriers between his dimension and Earth with her ruling by his side. Raven knew what was coming, fleeing to Earth in order to assemble a group of heroes to fight the great battle against her father, forming what we know now as the Teen Titans. And how great the battle would be between Raven’s newfound friends and her terrible father who to this day continues to scheme behind the scenes, waiting for the perfect opportunity to strike and make our world his own.

Experience & Skill

Dormammu

To understand the skills of Dormammu, a multi-faceted agent of chaos, one must examine it in several aspects. For one he is a conqueror, who took the Dark Dimension by force and has ruled over it for millennia, a feared being who countless beings have come to fear and respect. He states that he is older than Strange’s concept of time would allow him to understand. Being feared by the likes of Odin, and labeled as a potent power by Eternity. He headed and became leader of the Lords of the Nether-Worlds. He’s taken countless realities by force, through his tactician as a warlord, including the likes of Mephisto’s realm. He’s even ambushed the pinnacle of Kree gene modification by using strategies unguessable to those unfamiliar with his magic. During his time possessing Ego, Dormammu came up with an extremely complicated plan that involved him targeting 5 specific planets in the universe to create a pentagram the size of the entire galaxy so he could merge it with the Dark Dimension, giving him the power to conquer everything with only a single thought.

Not only has he bested demons in war, he also matches them in cunning, because this deal maker is quite Faustian in nature. He managed to strike a deal to prevent his magic from being taken away so other foes could be focused on and has duped the likes of super geniuses like Reed Richards and his arch adversary Doctor Strange, and other heroes like the Ghost Rider. He’s also a master of manipulation, and full of crafty and heinous plots always two steps ahead. He managed to strike a deal to prevent his magic from being taken away so other foes could be focused on. He’s capable of orchestrating long running and layered plots such as arranging for Parker Robins to become The Hood while making it look like a total accident, or manipulating Baron Mordo into turning on the Ancient One to take out the Sorcerer Supreme. He can deceive and dogwalk those around them in games of wit, even Clea, his niece who knew him for years, was totally fooled by one of his disguises.

But to talk about warmongering, and puppeteering doesn’t do justice to where the dread lord excels more than any other, not only is he a god, he’s something greater, a sorcerer! The man not only generates magic, he masters it. He knows countless spells (see abilities section), and can go tit for tat with Doctor Strange and other Sorcerer Supreme tier spell casters. And if you thought he was all spells and incantations… No, apparently bro can just straight up throw hands, having dedicated centuries to training in combat, and could even go blow to blow with Strange in hand to hand combat in a competition where neither were allowed to use spells.

To call Dormammu a threat is an undersell. He’s a master sorcerer, warmongering conqueror, demonic diplomat, and a nigh-all powerful god all wrapped in one. Putting just one label doesn’t do him justice, for if you engage in battle with the master of the Dark Dimension, you better do so with dread.

Trigon

Ever since he was born, it was apparent that the demon lord Trigon was made to conquer everything he laid his eyes on and would do anything it took to bend those around him to his will. As soon as he was born, Trigon slew all around him including his mother. At the age of 1 he conquered his world, by age 6 he destroyed it, and by age 30 he conquered his entire dimension and made the “million million” worlds within it his plaything. He would eventually set his sights on our universe, specifically the Earth which would become his target for much of his lifetime as would the group his daughter assembled to combat him: the Teen Titans who Trigon is always more than a match for. The Titans have members like Starfire, a warrior from Tamaran, a planet whose people are stated to be hard to match in the art of war and Starfire herself has undergone weeks of retraining to better hone her skills with her soon to be husband yet Trigon was able to make short work of her and the rest of her friends even when he was around the height of a normal human, not the gargantuan giant we all know him as. It also doesn’t hurt that Trigon has been around for a long time. Trigon stated that before there was time he already ruled over a dozen dark kingdoms and both Belial and Raven mention serving under him for around an eternity, giving him plenty of experience under his belt conquering dimensions and facing all kinds of different foes.

However, Trigon is much more than a skilled warrior but also a master manipulator and planner. One of his official powers is possessing supernatural knowledge which he frequently uses in his machinations. He was able to get around being trapped by the Divine’s barrier by using his unorthodox method of reincarnation to be reborn into other universes. One of his most impressive showings of intelligence was when he set up a scheme to take out everyone who was once a Teen Titan by using his vast influence to attack the Titans in a variety of ways with various demons and his sons leading the charge as he was depowered at the time. His plan was actually pretty successful as the attacks led to the death of Power Boy and left several other Titans in not great condition like Little Barda and Cyborg. Possibly his greatest showing of cunning was when Trigon orchestrated a complex battle on Earth, pitting himself and his three sons against the Teen Titans all in a scheme to make the superheroes look weak by creating illusions of dead civilians to fool them as well as the public in order to hurt their reputation. In addition to this his true goal of the battle was to get the Titans to trust Raven as an ally and friend, implanting her into the team as a spy and report back to him, a plan that went off without a hitch.

Equipment

Dormammu

The Black Dechantment

In one of his attempts at conquering our dimension, Dormammu attained the Black Dechantment while “plumbing the depths of prehistory”, which he used to turn magic users into conduits for the Mindless Plague, managing to infect Tony Stark, Beast, Reed Richards, and Doctor Doom, with world governments and economies already threatening to collapse at just 1 in 100,000 conversion rates as the infection spreads down from the smartest to dumbest on the “cerebral foodchain”. The Black Dechantment itself bypasses magical resistances, with Dormammu himself stating all who manipulate the mystic arts are vulnerable to the material, and bullets or restraints formed from it can be used to bring major sorcerers in the Marvel universe like Daimon Hellstorm, Wiccan, Scarlet Witch, and Doctor Strange to near death or leave them restrained and depowered. Dormammu has been shown able to fire chunks of it from the Dark Dimension to Asgard faster than Heimdall could even see it, and in turn corrupt him and shatter the Bifrost, suggesting it also nullifies magical objects.

The Dark Dimension

Yes, Dormammu has an entire dimension as part of his arsenal. In fact, The Dark Dimension is the very sort of dimension that Dormammu is the ruler of, after being banished by Faltine. The Dark Dimension is the largest piece of a Splinter Realm that used to be the original Dark Dimension, which was one big plane. The Dark Dimension here is stated to possess more spatial dimensions than the universe itself and also exists beyond the transfinite multiverse. He’s shown to be able to attack foes all the way from it, showcasing insane dimensional range. Another thing to mention is that the Faltine contains even more than the Dark Dimension already has.

Trigon

Staff

Trigon's most frequent weapon of choice in his conquests is a staff. He has been shown to summon it at will and use its main function: firing powerful blasts of energy at his opponents.

Sword

In his conquest through various dimensions, Trigon has been shown using a sword to slice his enemies to ribbons, even doing so alongside Raven for some fun father daughter bonding time.

Cosmic Cannon

The Cosmic Cannon is… well, a giant screw off cannon that Trigon uses to destroy planets within his own dimension.

The Dark Dimension

Being a Lord of Hell and on-off again member of the Triumvirate that rules it, Trigon has claim over his own piece of Hell known as…the Dark Dimension. Well that’s not gonna be confusing at all. While we will be going over Hell itself in more detail in the DC Cosmology section, what’s specifically unique to Trigon’s space is his realm’s connection to the Chamber of All or Nothing, an ancient labyrinth connecting to anywhere you can think of and anywhere you can't. Its steps and doorways are in constant flux as the chamber is infinite and eternal in both directions. It also connects to anywhen, allowing for time travel effectively. Trigon’s eyes appear through every door in the Chamber, looking constantly for doors to worlds worthy to invade across infinite realities, though he cannot open the doors himself and needs others on the other side to open the doors for him.

Abilities

Dormammu

Enhanced Faltine Physiology

Being born of the Faltine race, Dormammu is composed of flames that are a pure source of ethical magic, or pure raw extradimensional energy and act as an amorphous mass, allowing him to alter his form at will, sprouting additional appendages such as limbs or wings. This also means that whatever physical form he takes are merely “suits” he wears and isn’t really harmed by physical attacks, it being a trivial feat for him to restore his body if he wants to. His flames can also be expelled combatively. He can shoot magic flames out from his hands, which can be so great in size that they can incinerate entire armies. He can also deflect magic from the likes of Loki back at them. The faltines are extradimensional beings composed of pure extradimensional energy, and Dormammu is no exception. 

Through his countless eons of conquering, sorcery, and mastery of the Dark Dimension which he constantly pulls from, Dormammu has evolved beyond the realms of mere physical and metaphysical, he has become an idea, a shared belief, so long as beings imagine and continue to believe in him, he shall always reconstitute his form, no matter the odds. This energy is generated and takes shape from the worship of lesser beings but also from evil and sin, the mere idea of evil feeding into his form, which means even if he suffers complete existential destruction, Dormammu shall always return. And thanks to this belief, he can also regain any lost power, even being able to become stronger than ever in spite of being stopped from reforming for a long time. Because of this, it also means Dormammu’s powers are constantly growing and evolving. This also means that Dormammu’s resulting manifestations are alien and disharmonious in nature, meaning he naturally resists most forms of magic, and can only be vulnerable to magic if the correct harmonious dimensions are met.

Dormammu is able to create aspects of himself that are made of magic. These aspects are capable of interacting with others and not just some holographic projection. But these aspects still have their weaknesses, like when one of them got hit by Hulkling’s sword, which disrupts magic. Since these aspects are made of magic, it got obliterated. But also within the center of this existential huddle of pure energy, a true “core”, “center” heart of his existence, the highest concentration and idea of his being, but don’t believe its fundamentality makes it vulnerable to those that can access it, because it naturally defends and forces out which attack it, even shredding against Dr. Strange’s intangible astral form.

Acausality

Dormammu, extra-dimensional Hell-Lord that he is, is older than the very concept of time itself. He doesn’t naturally exist within space or time, and other Hell-Lords like Hela have described time as existing all at once for her. Other realms counted amongst the Splinter Realms such as Limbo have time as existing underneath and sideways from the rest of the multiverse, this broadly applying to all dimensions of the Splinter Realms. Reality is nonlinear in the domain of Hell-Lords, where even on the path to such hells contain every possibility that can happen at once. And as mentioned before, Dormammu could look into prehistory and took for himself the Black Dechantment.

Clairvoyance/Magic Senses 

Dormammu is capable of presenting visions around him, whether it be of past, current or future events. As seen above, he can manifest future events, he can also create clairvoyant projections to communicate with others, as well as using visions to watch heroes from a distance or to see through deceits. Dormammu also has the power to sense others through his magic, like whenever there are enemies approaching. He can even track magical signatures like Doctor Strange’s. Illusions that can fool even sorcerers like Mordo are easily seen through by Dormammu.

Concealment 

Being a master manipulator also means that Dormammu has the ability to be undetectable, hiding himself away when the situation calls for it. Dormammu is capable of hiding his presence from mystical senses, This can even apply to when Dormammu wants to pose as another being, like when he disguised himself as a Faerie named Flyx, and no one suspected anything.

Mental Manipulation/Telepathy

Dormammu’s Mental Manipulation is another efficient ability when it comes to his control over others. This power is how Dormammu is able to puppeteer the Mindless Ones, which he states he is able to do by learning how to subconsciously influence them. Dormammu learned how to do this while trapped in their dimension. But this goes beyond just the Mindless Ones, Dormammu has the ability to control his foes and stop them in their tracks. Even powerful Mystics like Magik here have been under the influence of Dormammu’s Manipulation, making her hold still so that she can watch her friends die. But Magik isn’t the only Mystic Dormammu has gained control over, he’s even mind controlled Scarlet Witch, and has been able to enter the mind of Dr. Strange. Speaking of Strange, Dormammu once used this power to swap Clea and Strange’s essence and put them in each other's bodies, Captain Ginyu style. This even extends to magic spells like Dense Blackness, an ability that can make all of humanity obedient to Dormammu.

This power even works across dimensions. Using it, Dormammu has been able to communicate with The Hood from the Dark Dimension, in spite of spells that prevent him from entering. But it’s not just limited to a singular being, it can be multiple of them across various dimensions.

Possession

As the name implies, Dormammu has the ability to possess others, whether willingly, or not. Dormammu does this by latching onto someone’s soul, and when the being is possessed, they gain Dormammu’s full power. Dormammu has possessed some pretty big name powerhouses in the Marvel universes such as Dr. Strange himself and the Spirit of Vengeance. It’s not just limited to a singular individual Dormammu can also possess multiple beings at once like when he took over the Chitauri through infecting/possessing the queen of the hive. Dormammu has even possessed all powerful beings such as Ego The Living Planet, and wore his corpse as a living skin. He also possessed a bunch of rats one time so that’s fun.

The only way Dormammu can be separated from the being he possessed if he doesn’t do it himself is through an exorcism, which can only be done through powerful magicians on the level of Dr. Strange, like Hellstorm does when Dormammu possessed Jennifer Kale. But even then, when Dormammu takes control, the being he possessed won’t always follow through with his commands. Another fault of this ability is that while he can wear the flesh of any human he has possessed, it also gives Dormammu the vulnerabilities that come with them.

Influence

Being the ruler of the Dark Dimension, Dormammu has his fair share of followers, and he’s going to make sure you remember that you serve under him. He regularly strikes deals with other entities, adding them and their dimensions to his servitude. This can be seen with one of his hosts, Parker Robbins, aka The Hood. At one point, Parker wanted to be free of being a host for Dormammu, but even when deliberately trying to shake him off, Dormammu wouldn’t leave him. As Dormammu later describes it, while Parker left him, he didn’t leave Parker. To further add to this, the more Parker accepted the help of Dormammu, the deeper his influence on him got. Even similar powerful rulers of realms, fear and must heed to any command Dormammu makes.

The mere presence of Dormammu even made powerful mystics like Wong and Sara freeze without even shedding a tear in his presence, as well as making Thor feel a chill with just a mere stare. But when Dormammu sees no further use out of his followers, their severance package…isn’t the most pleasant. This is seen when Krowler lost his sanity after Dormammu left his mind.

Reality Warping

Dormammu has the ability to warp reality itself, through his magic he can bend and shape universes to his whim. Once he had dominion over the Earth, he transformed all of reality itself. But Dormammu can use his reality warping in more creative ways, like flattening the Baxter Building to trap everyone inside as seen above. Dormammu’s reality warping even extends to effecting beings on the astral plane, like he did against Strange’s own astral form, shaping it into believing and fitting in with his own ideals.

Absorption

So what do you do when you have unlimited power? Very philosophical question, but Dormammu has a very simple answer: more. Besides the fact he can already channel and absorb “infinite umbral energy” from his own dimension, Dormammu’s sickening greed is superbly represented through his ability to “consume” beings entirely and add them to his very being, adding their power to his own. While Faltine already naturally feed off of other energy sources, sis absorption is significantly more thorough, capable of draining life force, power, magic, willpower/consciousness, connections and binds to aetherial forces like the Flames of Regency, oh and also ENTIRE REALITIES. Should be no surprise when his whole thing is acquiring dimensions like a game of monopoly. His proficiency in assimilation extends even further, he can drain power through vestiges not even having to physically be there to drain someone, and if he’s feeling a bit cheeky, he can even siphon your power into a new being entirely.

Soul/Astral Form Manipulation and Non-Physical Interaction

Fitting for such a thematically demonic entity, Dormammu has the power to manipulate souls, even ones from immortal beings. Dormammu is even stated to be “the eater of souls” and all souls in the Dark dimension empower him. He's capable of grabbing Strange’s astral form in the midst of a fight and causing harm to it. He once even fought Dahlea’s astral and physical forms at the same time, the former even being made from the threads of life and energy that knit creation itself. Even while weakened, Dormammu’s mere presence shredded Clea’s astral form and would’ve destroyed her.

Transmutation

Dormammu has the power to manipulate the matter of both himself and other beings around him. Examples of Dormammu using his matter manipulation on himself include growing extra arms and making himself tower over cities and canyons.

As for other examples of Dormammu’s matter manipulation, he’s been able to conjure stones out of nowhere and could even congeal Dr. Strange’s own atoms. He has also used this spell to transform Thor back into Donald Blake with a simple hand gesture and once turned Baron Mordo into a mystic ball. This spell has also been shown to work on multiple beings at once, like the time Dormammu transformed various citizens into monsters, spanning across the universe as implied here. Hell, Dormammu’s own manipulation over matter is how he killed his own father in the first place (as seen above), and why he and Umar were banished.

Teleportation/Summoning/BFR

Among Dormammu’s most prominent abilities is his power over translocation. Traveling between realities with ease (when he’s not land locked), as well as anywhere in between. While this locomotion is carried through mere warping, he can also conjure portals if he’s feeling dramatic. This power extends further, as not only can he transport himself, he can transport others, most often he uses this to summon demonic legions at his beck and call, and obviously endless gates of his Mindless Ones. He can pull people from other dimensions, even from Earth whilst still being banished from it, at one point he was even able to teleport Clea out of dimensional binds!

If you tick him off, he can do the opposite, and banish you to different dimensions, something his servant Mordo had to learn the hard way…. Though he didn’t exactly retain the lesson. This warping can also be like an endless tunnel, like when he propelled The Ancient One and Doctor Strange to different realities past the edge of infinity with a mere hand gesture, a process which was described as irresistible, proven by the aforementioned duo being helpless against it. Though you’re lucky if he just sends you to some nameless nether void or lifeless dimension, because otherwise you might be subject to the misfortune of being sent to his diabolical dimension. Though his most impressive demonstration of his dimensional displacement might have been when he remotely warped every single superhero or being capable of opposing him across the world to a decaying pocket dimension, in a feat he claimed to be as “easy as thought”.

Sealing

If Dormammu wants to seal a being away, he’s got multiple ways to do so. He can seal people into objects, like when he sealed Dilby inside of a gem, as well as cocoons, mystic cages, and mystical spheres, like with what he does to, Clea’s father, Loki, Mephisto, and his sister Umar for years (which was only broken after his defeat). But Dormammu’s sealing magic is not just limited to one being, he can seal multiple people at once, like here when he sealed numerous people inside the G’uaranthic Guardian. Dormammu also once sealed Gaea away to the insides of the earth. As if that wasn’t enough, Dormammu can even seal beings like the Mindless Ones into a mystic barrier, and once sealed Clea into another dimension entirely.

Forcefield Creation

A magic forcefield Dormammu uses to block attacks. This has been used in the past to block attacks from the likes of Dr. Strange, Clea, and Loki, and he can summon a thousand of these at once. These barriers can even be amped by magical artifacts, like when Strange increased the power of Dormammu’s barrier using his amulet. He’s able to sustain barriers like these for years, such as the one he conjured to keep the Mindless Ones at bay.

Power Bestowal

Dormammu has bestowed his power to his followers, one of which includes Mordo. According to Strange, Dormammu’s power is the source of Mordo’s most evil magic, and Mordo when amped had surpassed Strange in power. He also once granted The Hood the power to track magical signatures, like Doctor Strange’s. If he’s ever in a rather unfavorable situation, he can even bestow his dark power onto conduits of his choosing. Another example was when Dilby, a lackey of Doom, got some mystical power from Dormammu, he was able to conjure robots out of thin air. While it takes a near fatal amount of power to do this, he needs only to rest briefly before his power is back to normal. He’s even given soul energy to Strange when it benefits him.

Images of Ikonn

A spell that allows Dormammu to cast illusions. One of its simpler uses is that of hiding his identity, which he does from The Hood. He has used this spell to create multiple beings, like when Dormammu made a bunch of fake Dr. Strange’s in his battle against Ghost Rider. Dormammu has even created illusions of whole worlds within the Dark Dimension using this spell. His illusions have proven to be so potent that Strange was capable of almost merging with an illusory version of himself, fully convinced that it was real. According to the MMRPG Rulebook, Images of Ikonn is stated to create exact visual and audio duplicates of whatever Dormammu desires. He can even swap places with the illusion as he sees fit.

The Crimson Bands of Cyttorak

A spell from Cyttorak that can ensnare opponents in red bands that are virtually indestructible. They can even move faster than the speed of thought.

The Winds of Watoomb

Dormammu can utilize the Winds of Watoomb, a spell that calls upon the powers of Watoomb to create a powerful mystical air current.

Incineration

With minimal effort, Dormammu can incinerate a being with the hold of his magic, immediately engulfing the target into a blazed-like state and leaving no trace of them behind.

Power Nullification 

Dormammu is capable of shutting off a being’s powers. An example of this being Wiccan trying to use his magic, but couldn’t due to Dormammu’s interference. He’s capable of just “turning off” Thor’s divinity without removing Mjolnir. It is implied Dormammu is also capable of repealing curses, like when Loki was cursed to be blind, but Dormammu didn’t feel like repealing it. For a dubiously canon example, Dormammu managed to formulate a spell Superman had to face a spell from Dormammu that incapacitated and was killing him before Miles Morales pulled the magic rock imbued with that spell away from him, Clark himself stating that that spell was as dangerous to him as Kryptonite is.

(Note: This last example seems to take place in a world where both Marvel & DC are canon unlike the Spider-Man & Superboy-Prime story which did set itself in actual canon providing timeframes for both Spidey & Prime in that story, however the Batman / Deadpool crossover established Marvel & DC crossovers happen when the Marvel & DC continuities… “intersect” to say the least which causes time and continuity to change. Regardless it was a fun feat to mention and is in line with what Dormammu can do).

Existence Erasure

Dormammu has the power to erase a person or entire groups of people with only just a thought. He is also capable of erasing objects like Iron Man’s armor. He even attempted to use it on Umar, sibling of the year ladies and gentlemen.

Biology Manipulation

Dormammu has the ability to turn his target’s bones into jelly by simply speaking it. Gross.

Shapeshifting

Dormammu is no stranger to altering his body for his own purposes, like when he was able to make himself look like his mortal enemy: Stephen Strange. He can even maintain powers while shapeshifting. He also can make himself grow in size and even give himself some additional limbs, for aura farming of course.

Elemental Manipulation

While keeping Namor and Stephen Strange prisoner, Dormammu cast a dehydration spell on Namor in order to keep him incapacitated.

Sleep Manipulation

Dormammu once conjured up a potion which put the Mindless Ones into a deep sleep until he needed them further.

Miscellaneous Spells

• Cosmic Wind Spells: Can summon cosmic winds that cannot be fathomed by mortal minds

• Metal Manipulation: Can create mystical chains of binding, he’s capable of tightening the chains further to prevent escape

• Binding Spells: Creates a ring that he encloses on Loki and the Green Goblin to bind them

• Wasp Summoning: Can conjure a swarm of magic wasps

• Consciousness After Death: Can keep a consciousness alive post-mortem

• Mystic Time Trap Spell: Gave Mordo a spell to trap the Ancient One in a mystic time trap spell that would make the old man invisible to even Strange and his amulet. As he taught the spell, it is likely he knows it as well

• Mystic Sand Spells: Conjured Mystic Sand that not even Vision could phase through 

• Storm Conjuring: Conjured a storm which trapped Scarlet Witch in a solid state unable to move

• Barrier Destruction: Knows how to break barriers between universes

• Message Alteration: Dormammu, alongside Loki, intercepted and altered a message sent by the Black Knight across dimensions

• Torture Spells: Mystically tortures Hood for trying to defy him

• Healing: Dormammu once cured Parker Robbin’s mother of her dementia, which he used as a way to further his connection within Parker otherwise he would make her sick again.

• Resurrection: Using Dormammu’s power, Hood resurrected various people

• Perception Manipulation: Taunted Hood in a mirror, but others could not see him. Dormammu also appeared through a film Doctor Doom was watching

• Darkness Manipulation: Dormammu has an attack that can permanently blanket the Earth in darkness

• Light Manipulation: Can create flashes of blinding light

• Pain Manipulation: Dormammu’s return caused immense pain to Umar and Mordo

Resistances

• Most Exorcisms: According to Satana, exorcisms won’t work on Dormammu, given that he’s viewed as worse than a demon. The only way they can work on him is if a powerful magician on the same level as Dr. Strange manages to “unseat” Dormammu from his victim. Given Satana isn’t on that level of power, it proves that Dormammu can resist mystics on her level.

• Magic Binding: Dormammu believes that the combined magic of Dr. Voodoo, The Scarlet Witch, Man-Thing and more would not be able to bind him

• Law Manipulation: The Dark Dimension, an extension of Dormammu negates all laws, reality or otherwise 

• Madness/Mind Manipulation: Merely absorbing a fraction of Dormammu’s power drove Loki insane, and completely shattered his mind, reducing him to more than an infant. Unbothered by the effects of his own Dark Dimension, which causes a sort of “mental nausea” to those within it. Strange’s Astral form began to be warped and distorted upon coming across Dormammu’s mind.

• Dormammu has also fought Many Angled-Ones like Shuma-Gorath, whose mere presence claw at and corrupt the mind and soul and has overpowered the Ancient One mentally

• BFR/Banishment: Dormammu promptly came back after Umar inverted his banishment spell back on him.

• Power Absorption/Steal: Dormammu claims he could’ve regained his stolen power from Umar even if Strange had not intervened having just let him do so to avoid bargain, learning from past mistakes, claims he could’ve escaped a crystal designed to absorb Faltinian life-force if he weren’t at the time cut off from his pure essence, then promptly did so upon having this limitation removed. Doctor Doom, Moondragon and 3 of the Guardians create a magical pentagram to absorb Dormammu’s magic,which worked for a bit, however not only was the pain too much, it was unable to absorb ALL of Dormammu’s magic.

• General use of magic: Dormammu is so alien in nature, that groups of sorcerers cannot team up on him without perfect harmony, for he is perceived so differently their spells would begin to fail 

• Sealing: A sealing cocoon Umar created that she was confident would hold Dormammu failed almost instantly

• Existence Erasure: Umar’s own magic protected her from being erased from existence, which Dormammu should be capable of. Other Hell-Lords like Mephisto have no issues existing within the Outside, where prolonged exposure would completely erase powerful cosmic beings like the Silver Surfer or even Lifebringer Galactus.

• Fire and Soul Manipulation: Shrugged off Doctor Strange using the flames of the Ghost Rider on him

• Transmutation and Ice Manipulation: Dormammu once shook off Doctor Strange turning his blood into ice

• Essence Manipulation: Dormammu’s “core of his very being” defenses are so tricky, it can halt even Doctor Strange’s astral form from approaching safely 

• Illusions: He can simply see through and cancel out illusions cast by other sorcerors

• Empathetic Manipulation: Experienced 10 billion years of anguish at once in a matter of seconds and quickly recovered from it

• Precognition and Clairvoyance: Dormammu could attack Asgard and break the Bifrost without Heimdall noticing until it was too late, despite Heimdall being able to view other dimensions like the Negative Zone, perceive the multiverse until the Far Shore, and see the future

• Anti-Magic: Dormammu has no issues sitting on his throne made of the Black Dechantment and blocking a bullet made from it, whereas top tier magic users like Daimon Hellstorm, Scarlet Witch, and Dr. Strange all were drained from the Black Dechantment instantly

• Worth pointing out that Absorbing Man later absorbs the material and fights Dormammu with it, but Dormammu survives even after Creel punches through his chest

Trigon

Demonic Physiology

Trigon is a demon from hell which is located in the Sphere of the Gods and is a pandimensional metaphysical being whose realm is a physical extension of himself. Being a demonic entity gives Trigon multiple different aspects of his existence that are important to make note of. Trigon and his children’s aura feel like death itself, making their surroundings feel cold  and he exists within all his children, and if he absorbed them he would gain infinite power because they are all merely parts of his soul. Raven falling into the depths of her soul and her greatest fears let Trigon loom over her. Trigon also states that Raven's soul self is a representation of her dark side, a power that she gets from him thus several powers that Raven displays, as well as his family (Etrigan, Belial, etc.), Trigon should be more than capable of performing himself alongside resistances his children display.

In the New 52, Trigon’s origin would be altered a bit and expanded upon. Following his conquering of his home dimension, Trigon would seemingly allow himself to be summoned by a mysterious race called the Divine who try and get rid of Trigon through their tool: the Heart of Darkness, a massive construct that had devoured the souls of a hundred galaxies and absorbed all their evil, corruption, blasphemy, and degradation. The Divine however vastly underestimated this young Trigon, who would go on to overpower the effects of and absorb the entire Heart of Darkness gaining his powers and becoming the extradimensional threat we know today.

Trigon's physiology also makes him incredibly hard to put down for good. He can extend the bones out from his arms to further his reach and regenerate wounds such as being stabbed through the head, something that Etrigan has also survived. His son Belial regenerated his hands being sliced off as well as surviving having his heart ripped out by Raven, regenerating the injury in moments. Other demons like Blue Devil can regenerate from being burnt to death as long as he is in Hell. Demons have also shown the ability to phase through physical attacks, but esoteric energies like magic and Green Lantern projections can still interact with and harm them. The hell lord can also reincarnate himself by having a child with a woman, and becoming that baby when they were born allowing him to make his way into other universes to decimate them or by infecting others with his seed which will let him resurrect himself by taking over another beings soul (more on those later.) Even after he had his body destroyed by the spirits of Azarath they stated that they couldn't destroy Trigon's energy and after the Titans destroyed his soul while he attempted to reincarnate himself, he was able to resurrect in his realm much to the surprise of his daughter and the Teen Titans, albeit he was weakened. Trigon himself states that he cannot die with Raven saying that demons don't die, they fade away. Demons are also stated to not require sleep. Demons possess life eternal and Trigon’s grandkids like Merlin and Etrigan have lived billions of years.

Abstract Existence

Another aspect of Trigon’s existence stems from the evils unleashed upon DC itself. Trigon is stated to be evil personified, being the concept of it, and also personifies darkness born from the unholy union of evil cast out of human souls and the mystical energy of Azarath. He was also one of the evils released from Pandora’s Box. 

Evil In DC Comics

In DC, evil is defined as a real thing that comes into existence in the absence of empathy, even being able to fester on races cleansed and purified. Trigon and other demons exist in a dimension only accessible by shattering the bounds of realities and entering the “Final Boundary” between body and soul. He and other demons truly exist in all of us, seeking to plunge us all into despair, within the dark wall inside the soul.

Cosmic Energy Manipulation

Trigon is able to manipulate various forms of energy. From across dimensions Trigon can unleash devastating attacks like his eye beams which are able to easily dismantle Booster Gold’s forcefield after two blasts in an alternate future or fire his Bolts of Destruction. And what demon would be complete without a bit of hellfire? Despite looking more like an energy beam, Trigon can actually shoot out hellfire, an attack that Bar Torr wasn’t sure Superboy could take and used it to incinerate several scientists who had failed him. He is also capable of absorbing different types of energy such as when he was able to absorb the evil energies from nearly one hundred galaxies. His sons have even shown the ability to steal power, from Trigon himself no less when he was incredibly weakened.

Soul Manipulation

One of Trigon's most noteworthy and devastating powers is his mastery over manipulating souls, which has decimated millions of worlds. Trigon can drain the souls of billions, siphoning them for power and can reshape them however he pleases and even merge with souls like when he became merged with Azarath's after they shed their physical form to destroy him, in turn corrupting them. He pierced Violet's soul and cut it as seen above. He is stated to be able to cause immense pain to Jericho's soul to where “his soul burns eternally but never die, his bones will be crumbled into ash but will never die,will live forever, live in pain forever, in horror forever but never die” until Raven saved him. Dark Raven later does something similar, “exploding” his souls “bones”. Raven was also able to absorb the souls of dying soldiers to replenish her strength and is stated to be able to rip someone's soul from their body. Trigon is even shown casually drinking souls when just having some down time which Etrigan is also stated to be able to do. Miscellaneous demons can simply devour souls.

Hellfire is made from the first souls of the damned, fueled by their pain, suffering, and hopelessness. It can incinerate the soul and body. Even gods aren't immune to it and will have their essences totally destroyed if they are blasted enough by it. Proficient enough users of hellfire can choose to use it to enslave the soul instead of destroy it. It is potent enough that Martian Manhunter could not withstand his mind and soul being burnt by hellfire for long. When blasted by hellish energies by comparable demons to Trigon like Neron, Wonder Woman’s mind and soul were so badly damaged she actually died, passing on to The Source, needing to be resurrected by the goddess Hera.

Souls in DC Comics

Souls in DC have been described as akin to a pure monad, infinite and divine. Formed from the universal substance that is infinitely differentiated and endlessly extensible. Unable to be annihilated and perpetuated onto eternity, however the strands that form them can be unpicked and separated. Even some of the most powerful mystical beings like The Endless are made of “soul-stuff”, and losing too much of that can kill them.

Mind Manipulation/Illusions

Trigon is able to manipulate minds very easily, and does so to the Teen Titans very often, toying with their greatest fears and emotions in their early bouts. If it’s convenient, he can even project the memories of his opponents into their mind. When the powerful psychic Psimon encountered Trigon, the dark lord easily controlled him and subsequently the “Fearsome Five” all the way from his home dimension. Trigon was also able to mentally speak to and attempt to mind control Raven from his dimension all the way to Azarath. One of his greatest feats of mind control was taking over four of the Teen Titans at once which faded when he left Earth, and he’s been compared to Hive Queen in psionic might, one of the most powerful psychics in DC Comics. 

 His daughter is also skilled at manipulating memories as she could wipe memories from the Teen Titans minds. In a similar vein, Trigon is called an extremely skilled illusion caster, and can cast realistic illusions to fool his enemies, fitting for a master manipulator. He once created an illusion of dead soldiers to make the Titans look like they failed to protect people during his invasion, worsening their reputation. He also once appeared to Raven as an illusion and made his fortress invisible, making Skeets unable to scan the inside of it. His son Belial was able to shroud himself so he was invisible to the naked eye and made illusions of his brothers to show the Phantom Stranger who he'd be dealing with if he incurred their wrath.

Corruption

Trigon was slowly corrupting Ravens mind and soul into Dark Raven with it being described as her mind being turned into “a battle ground,whipped and ripped asunder torn from the fabric of reality” and “ripping away at the fabric of her very being” with her physical features being warped to be more evil. The evil found within Raven’s soul was not her own nature, but rather Trigon's. When Dark Raven teleported the Titans souls out of their body they were forced to fight evil versions of themselves in which if they kill their evil versions they would become evil themselves. Though if someone else controls those evil versions it can backfire on Trigon since his powers are what made them, they get stronger every time his energy is used against them as seen when dark raven could literally do nothing against them.

Power Bestowal

Trigon is shown granting Psimon his powers which he then uses to terrorize the Titans before Trigon's arrival on Earth.

Matter Manipulation/Transmutation

Trigon atomized Psimon, letting him retain his consciousness, and then scattered his atoms across the Lightstream to suffer forever. When killing the Divine he removed their flesh and created apparel for him to wear from it. He has also reduced a child to ashes by merely pointing at her and even apparently disintegrated a guy because he called him four eyes. Raven stated she could remove the bonds holding Neron's atoms together and when tapping into her dark side seemingly increased the density of the air. In addition to being able to affect things on the atomic level, Trigon has shown the ability to change things around him with transmutation. During his second attack on Earth, Trigon possessed a decaying aura which turned all of the planet's population to stone structures of “living souls” and “living flesh”, including the likes of Superman and other heroes (though doing this did drain his energy). It's also stated that he can transmute the elements.

Environmental/Weather Manipulation

During his scheme to take out anyone who was ever a Titan, Trigon attacked multiple members by making the environment much more deadly like making spikes made from the Earth try and stab Arsenal as seen above, trying to melt Beast Boy with lava or attacking a group of Titans with more earth manipulation. He is also seen being able to manipulate the weather by summoning lightning strikes or by creating a worldwide storm.

Astral Projection

Even while locked away in his dimension, Trigon can project himself into other universes. His most common form of projection is when he manifests himself before people as smoke/dark clouds with merely his evil gaze being present as he communicates across worlds. Despite just being a pair of evil eyes, Trigon can still attack targets with his eye beams or by making lightning strike down from the sky.

Portal Creation

Trigon has been shown to create portals to travel across dimensions or throw someone through them to help his opponent make a fast exit.

Biological Manipulation 

Trigon can manipulate aspects of a person's body however he pleases. When a little girl once commented on Trigon’s monstrous appearance, he made her blood literally boil with what onlookers call his “death stare.” In his battle against Raven and Arella, Trigon could age up the latter into an old and frail woman in moments. When Wally West ran at him in a blind rage, Trigon made his heart suddenly stop and start repeatedly, toying with him. And then he can also be a bit silly with it, like controlling Wally's body and forcing him to keep spinning deep into the ground. The gap between all souls bound this way is infinitesimal.

Trigon Seeds

When Trigon’s body perished, he had sent his genetic patterns into “Trigon seeds”, destroying the “still-living” souls of his spawn, these seeds are Trigon himself and one of them would enter Raven’s soul-self after the destruction of her body and allow Trigon to manipulate her into birthing him once more, in turn killing her. Dark Raven, believing herself to be resurrecting her siblings, sought out metahumans to plant these seeds in, as those without enough power would wither into desiccated husks and explode. Trigon used this on Beast Boy, leaving a demonic side that resided within him that can be awakened with even the smallest spark. Trigon’s magic in the seeds is so strong that even after it was supposed to be totally removed from him, hints of it still remained in Beast Boy.

While it’s unknown if this is exactly the same ability, Belial has demonstrated a very similar ability where he implanted the seed of his son, Etrigan, into the soldier that would arrest Jesus, allowing the seed to influence the man and follow Belial's bidding. However it was ultimately exorcised by Jesus Christ, possibly meaning it isn’t infallible.

Possession

He can reach out to your soul and possess you. When filled with negative emotions, Raven's mind was at risk of being taken over by Trigon. He can possess targets from light-years away.

Size Manipulation 

Trigon can alter his size at will should he choose to do so (his official height is listed as variable.) In his first appearance he was taller than a normal person but still around the size of a human. During his second invasion however, he became so large he can be seen using part of Titans Tower as a chair. Trigon more often than not chooses to remain at large sizes to tower over his opponents.

Teleportation/Summoning

Trigon can teleport himself and others at will. He teleported himself and Raven back to his dimension as well as sending his sons to Earth. He even teleported behind Raven and Arella to jumpscare them. Raven can teleport people to her home dimension of Azarath as well. On top of normal teleportation Trigon is capable of summoning a variety of monsters to aid him in his conquests if need be like when he opened a portal flanked by an army of demons to kidnap Raven. His daughter stated she could summon demons or demigods to aid her but decided not to.

Battlefield Removal

Famously in his first proper appearance, Trigon banished Psimon into the Lightstream by scattering his atoms across it. He has also chucked Raven through a portal to get her out of his way. Dark Raven teleported the Titans souls out of their bodies into a column where they would fight their evil counterparts and she is even capable of banishing someone to the Phantom Zone.

Cosmic Senses

He could see that Baron Winters was watching him from the Wintersgate Mansion, which exists in all eras of time. Trigon sensed the energy of the Rings of Azar which were ready to bring Raven back. He should also compare to Raven, who was able to feel a scream in her very soul and detect an illusionist through her strong sense of magic.

Temporal Manipulation

Trigon states that time has as much meaning as he gives it in his kingdoms with Raven backing up this statement by saying time passed like an eternity in his realm despite it having only been a few years since she vanished from Earth. Raven and Belial have been shown to be able to manipulate time, the latter stopping it with a mere gesture and the former once doing it so she could have more time on her date. With Trigon’s powers Psimon even threatened to hurl Doctor Light into the past.

Power Nullification

The hotel belonging to the Sons of Trigon overlaps with Trigon's realm which is stated to be messing with the magic of the Phantom Stranger and his companions. Raven was able to cast a spell that turned off her opponents lightning powers. Kings and members of the Triumvirate of Hell can render people powerless within Hell.

Resurrection

Trigon is shown to have brought the angel Zauriel back from the dead. Raven is also capable of bringing someone back to life as seen when she revived Nightwing.

Telekinesis

While occasionally used to throw his chud sons through stalagmites, he’s also used it to wrap Bunker in his own bricks and slam the Titans Tower to smithereens. While it's not outright telekinesis, Trigon was shown forcing Psimon to his knees, making him kneel before his master. Belial is also seen using telekinesis on his hotel, threatening to destroy it.

Barrier Creation/Attack Reflection

Trigon can create barriers to fend off the Titans assault as well as reflecting Cyborg's sound waves back at him. Raven is also capable of making forcefields 

Shapeshifting

When first meeting Raven’s mother, Trigon disguised himself as a handsome young man to enthrall her. While disguised, his usually potent evil aura was suppressed and hidden from her up until he revealed himself. He isn't just limited to presenting himself as a human, he has also altered his appearance to look like Beast Boy in order to fool Raven.

Spatial Manipulation (Limited)

After 20 years and the defeat of the guardians maintaining the barrier, Trigon managed to tear down the dimensional walls between his realm and Earth. He can use souls to amplify this ability as during his second attack on Earth, he stated he siphoned souls from his dimension to escape the Netherverse and return to Earth. He was then going to absorb our dimension into his to restore life to his now dead world.

Miscellaneous Demonic Abilities

• Empathic Manipulation: Demons literally consume pain and process it into a drug that gives them ecstacy and pleasure.
• Nonduality/Paraconsistent Physiology: Entities from the Collective Unconscious do not follow the Laws of Logic
• Regeneration (Non-Combat Applicable): When demons are sufficiently torn apart and discorporated, it takes them a thousand years to reform
• Technology Manipulation: Demons can hijack and take control over technology like missile targeting systems or helicopters
• Reality Warping (Within Hell/Conquered Worlds): Powerful demons can undo damage done in their vicinity, but they cannot disrupt the fundamental laws of the universe from Hell or even on Earth.

Resistances

• Heat Manipulation: Trigon has consistently no sold Starfires starbolts which are said to be as hot as a star
• Soul Manipulation: Trigon survived the Heart before gaining his powers, which is stated to feed on souls. Raven’s soul self was pulled into another dimension that she states was trying to destroy her soul and could even act on its own to resist Eric’s attempts to absorb her soul
• Mind/Will Manipulation: Could resist the effects of Donna Troy’s lasso which is stated to have the same effects as Wonder Woman's Lasso of Truth which famously compels the target to tell the truth and can control the target's mind.
• The Lasso of Truth has other properties that should grant Trigon these additional resistances:
• Soul Manipulation: The lasso can reach into your soul, torture souls, bind souls and destroy them
• Memory Manipulation: Forcefully showed someone their entire life which caused the thug to kill himself
• Biological Manipulation: Arella has said that Raven can’t get sick due to her soul-self protecting her from all illnesses
• Purification/Cleansing: When Starfire used Raven’s Soul-Self to cleanse Beast Boy of the Trigon seed, the seed resisted her
• Body Puppetry: Demons like Etrigan have proven immune to voodoo dolls
• BFR/Sealing (Limited): Despite being sealed and trapped numerous times like when he was sealed into the Netherverse by Arella, Trigon was able to escape by siphoning billions of souls and was going to do something similar with Earth's energy so he could return home and restore his universe, bypassing the difficulty he usually has piercing the barriers between dimensions. It is also implied that a young Trigon before he gained his powers was only teleported to the Divine because he allowed it.
• Existence Erasure: Angel fire from the likes of Zauriel can incinerate the Phantom Stranger to where he ceased to exist, reducing him to a state of nothingness where he has lost individuality and has been erased from memory and history. The Phantom Stranger required intervention from The Presence to save and restore him back into existence. Demons comparable to or weaker than Trigon like Etrigan and Morax have resisted angelic fire from similarly powerful angels like Duma and Remiel when they were tasked with ruling over Hell.
  

Nonstandard Forms

Dormammu

Flyx

A form that Dormammu took of a Faerie, in order to trick Clea and the others into helping him regain control of the Dark Dimension and his powers. Despite being significantly smaller than Dormammu’s regular form, he still retains at least some powers and abilities while in this state.

Ego

After Ego’s death, it’s been 10 whole days where he became a black insect-like egg, and he hasn’t been changing, until one day, the egg started to crack. Ego was gone, and his corpse would be used as a living furnace that houses a terrible flame. Ego was no longer, it was now Dormammu! Using Ego’s body like a skin, Dormammy went around causing havoc across the universe, summoning entire armies of Mindless Ones from his very jaws. However he wasn’t simply targeting planets for fun, his entire plan was to target 5 planets in separate locations to create a pentagram the size of a galaxy. He would use it as a summoning circle so that he could merge their reality with the dark dimension. Which would allow Dormammu to conquer everything that exists with a single thought. And with all the five planets, he would continue to grow stronger. After a while Dormammu created another teleportal, however a giant one to give himself a massive body. What makes this impressive is that the only time Ego could’ve gained a body was thanks to Galactus giving him a massive power boost. It took Doom, Moondragon, and three guardians to create a specific pentagram so that they could absorb his energy, but even that wasn’t enough, in the end though, Dormmamu got banished back to the Dark Dimension, thanks to Rocket a bullet filled with Antimagic causing it to specifically destroy Ego’s body.

Eternity

After slaying the entity with his sister, Dormammu briefly took on his cosmic form before returning to his more usual appearance with Eternity’s power. With this power, he was capable of causing a shift in the essence of all being. Shortly after, he created his own twisted version of Earth-616, one with a completely altered planet and timestream. As Strange put it, Dormammu siphoned the infinite energies of Eternity, an entity that “is everything” on all levels of creation, a terrifying degree of power even as a fraction. As stated by Namor, he and Strange were the only entities he didn’t have control over due to not being created by him, further proving that he had control over everything else. Despite this, Dormammu could physically feel the two intruders enter his universe. With this power, had it not been for his obsession, he could simply think Strange out of existence. Despite his omniscience, he was still susceptible to being fooled by Strange’s magic.

Trigon

None notable.

Support

Dormammu

Mindless Ones

Dormammu’s multiversal conquest led him to amassing many races, but none as notable or as iconic as the Mindless Ones. Entities that were initially planted by his rival Plokta as a way of slowing him down. While at first they gave him trouble, requiring barriers to hold them off, Dormammu eventually learned to weaponize them, using the infinite amount of them to his advantage in many battles, being able to command them like puppets while still using a protective spell to hold them at bay in the Dark Dimension. The Mindless Ones have served Dormammu for centuries and have slain many deadly warriors under his name, along with giving several Marvel heroes trouble like the Hulk, Thor, Namor, Silver Surfer, and of course, Doctor Strange. They also have a ship called the Mindless Gun.

These guys are literal walking tanks of near incalculable magic energy, who are on sight with just about anything that meets their gaze. They have displayed their own magical prowess in being able to form portals, firing optic beams, and regenerating and duplicating if damaged critically. Part of why they’re so unkillable is because they exist as an expression of magical energy itself, being a principle of magic within the Marvel Universe. Additionally, they, as their name suggests, are so immune to mental attacks, that it hardly even fazes them.

Dormammu has also crafted specialized Mindless Ones, chief being his most recent mindless creation: The Blazing Hound. Made from the remains of a Proemial God, ancient deities that once fought and posed a threat to Galactus, the Blazing Hound could power through Clea's spells and launch attacks she and Wanda Maximoff, as the current Sorcerer Supreme, struggled to block. It's only beaten back when Dormammu himself loses concentration on controlling the hound. And since he’s the one who created the hound and relit its flames, attacks from the Blazing Hound nourish Dormammu. Though ultimately after Dormammu got his butt kicked the hound became a pet for Clea’s baby sister, but we’re giving it to him as it was his last appearance at the time of posting this blog. Neat how that works.

Dykkors

A race of demons that were trapped in a dimension by the Ancient One, once Dormammu was in the dimension, he became their leader. These demons have a thirst for human blood and twelve of them once bonded with Norman Harrison to become Zodiak.

The Chitauri

After infecting/possessing the queen of the hive, Dormammu took over the Chitauri and their entire planet. While the Chitauri may be simple minded, they are very technologically impressive and use their weaponry to go to war against many types of foes throughout the universe. Under the rule of Dormammu, they have been able to fight evenly against Doom’s Doombots.

G’uranthic Guardian

A giant stone statue that was constructed by G’uran The Great to defend the Dark Dimension during the era the G’uranthic Empire ruled over it. Dormammu then gains control over this statue and can summon it. Besides being really strong, the G’uranthic Guardian can drain people of their powers and can even imprison people inside of them, which cannot be reversed, even by powerful mystics like Umar. It is also quite resistant to possession, requiring multiple individuals, including Doctor Strange, in an attempt to even do so. However, his power draining can be countered if you pull an Odysseus and aim for the eye before he uses it on you.

Satannish

A creation of Dormammu that is considered to be one of his most powerful demons, even ruling over his own dimension. In fact, Satannish is so overpowered, he even took down Mephisto, pushed around Joe Fixit without much issue, and casually tanked attacks from Satan. Heck some guidebooks say he’s extradimensional.

He’s also no stranger to his own mystical powers, such as, being able to rip holes in reality, breaking even unbreakable minds designed to be immune to mental attacks, traveling or displacing others throughout dimensions, manipulating fire, shaking the earth with just his precense, summoning demons, raising the dead, sending out telepathic attacks, ending the life of others with just a touch, manipulating time, space, and matter, or altering or stealing someone’s very soul.

Baron Mordo

A sorcerer who once served under the ancient one, he sought out for Dormammu to seek more power. Which he would receive thanks to Dormammu’s power bestowal. Not only has he proved to be a powerful foe that's given Stephen Strange plenty of troubles, but he wouldn’t be a well respected and very feared user of the Mystic arts if he didn’t have a few powerful magical spells under his belt.

This includes, but is not limited to teleporting others through dimensions, turning people into monsters under his command, manipulating matter, generating green flames, crushing people into a ball, manipulating someone’s mind and emotions, putting others to sleep, conjuring barriers that trap the target the moment they make contact, removing souls from others and sealing them away, creating very deceiving illusions, displacing others in time, stealing magic, cancelling out other spells, or placing a spell that can forbid someone from speaking a specific phrase.

When empowered by Dormammu, he gains a few extra abilities, such as a spell that makes his presence go unnoticed and silences all protective devices, creating invisible spirits that can travel around the world, and virtually inexhaustible energy.

Umar

Dormammu’s sister who he has both worked and butted heads with. While she may not be as powerful as her brother, she is a force to be reckoned with regardless, even giving the likes of Thor a lot of trouble. If Dormammu needs her by his side, he can summon her at a moment’s notice. As for her support to her brother, Umar can synchronize her power with Dormammu, allowing their strength to flow through one another.

Umar is so powerful, she once shook Dormammu’s entire tower and blew a hole clean off it after doing it with the Hulk. Yeah, remember that moment from Hulk’s rundown in Hulk Vs Broly? That was her. She’s also capable of using her own magic of course, like making Thor weigh a score of planets, wiping memories, banishing foes, creating illusions, controlling emotions, turning objects into sentient creatures, reduce people to screaming blobs of jelly, dishing out psychic attacks, making a storm that spans dimensions, or summoning plants to bind enemies.

Trigon

Soldiers

Native to Trigon’s homeworld are a human-looking race which he keeps suppressed via soldiers wearing viking-style armor and armed with assault rifles.

Scientists

Ah yes, the natural science team to literal Satan. Anyways, these men were put to the task of giving Trigon so many kids that there would be enough to conquer the Multiverse.

Demons

During multiple of his conquests, Trigon has made use of multiple different types of demons to aid him in battles or schemes such as the horse he’s riding above, which was capable of firing an explosion from its mouths and toppling cars with its run. Bigger Trigon sentries guard his invisible chamber, wielding large battle axes. These sentries completely overwhelmed the Titans and reduced Azerath to a white void. 

Notable demons of Trigon’s include:

• Goronn: A giant demon prophesied to defeat the Justice League of America team composed of Wonder Woman, Batman, Hawkman, Hal Jordan, The Atom, and Zatanna.

• The “Titan Elimination Force”: When Trigon tried to eliminate everyone who was ever a Teen Titan he used several different kinds of demons to attack the superheros like a demon pig, shark, minotaur and more.

• Hell Hounds: An unnamed type of hellhound loyal to Trigon that totally dwarf normal humanoids

• Grey Demons: A host of dragon/gargoyle-like demons that can breathe fire from their mouths and torch buildings

The Sons Of Trigon

Trigon has had many children over the years but there are a specific three that stand above the rest. The trio is composed of Belial: the oldest and strongest, Ruskoff: the seemingly dimwitted one and Suge: the most reckless with extreme anger issues, all of whom are formidable weapons for their father. While they also technically no longer exist in the current timeline we will also be making note of his precious three sons: Wrath, Envy and Lust for more information and completion's sake.

All:

• Can take a hit from Superboy’s tactile telekinesis

• Fought the Justice League Dark

• Can play cards in an omni-directional casino with several millions of universes colliding all around and through them with no issue. The Phantom Stranger has difficulty navigating it and it's stated that if he fell, not even the Presence could save him.

• Can siphon magic off of Raven and manipulate the powers of sin

Belial:

• Previously a member of the Triumvirate of Hell alongside Beelzebub & Lucifer Morningstar

• Fought Lobo briefly even while weakened due to losing his heart (due to Etrigan)

• States he’s the deadliest of his brothers while feeling confident enough to break into the Phantom Strangers house and threaten him 

• Was going to bring down his hotel with telekinesis 

• Can shoot out hellfire in the form of flames or lightning, which is potent enough that Superboy needs protection from Raven’s soul-self to endure it

• Can take a punch from Superboy

• Beat the brakes off Superboy (and continues to do so despite Red Robin’s efforts)

• Can regenerate his sliced off hands in seconds

• Can regenerate his heart getting ripped out

• Defeated New-52 Lucifer and usurped the throne of Hell from him

• Belial sustained a spell that was transforming the entire universe into his domain and making it a part of himself

Ruskoff:

• Has an axe that cracked the ground and lets out splashes of hellfire

• Along with Suge gets his head sliced off but is able to survive the attack and casually carry his head around 

Suge:

• Can take a beating from Bar Torr

• Can possess people, but has to maintain some mental hold on them

• Casually stabs himself through the head after the Phantom Stranger rage baited him for like the 4th time during their poker game 

Wrath:

• Sent the Teen Titans flying with a shockwave and overpowered Starfire

Envy:

• Can become what somebody envies, and turns into Wonder Woman with her powers and strength 

• As Wonder Woman, punches Starfire and tanks her starbolt

• Turns into Barry Allen at the height of his powers

Lust:

• Manipulates Donna Troy and Wally West into nearly kissing

• Along with his brothers, siphons energy off of Trigon when he is at 1/10th of his power

Feats

Dormammu

Overall

• Became the ruler of the Dark Dimension

• Orchestrated the murders of Jack the Ripper in 1888 and the Great Fire London in 1666

• Stalemated Odin in a game of cosmic chess 

• Dormammu once (briefly) took over the realm of Dykkors

• Defeated Doctor Strange, the Ancient One, Silver Surfer, Thor, the Hulk, Ghost Rider, Gaea, and Mephisto

• Released the Mindless Plague onto Earth

• Alongside his sister Umar, killed and absorbed the power of Eternity itself

• Tied with Odin in chess

• Officiated his sister’s wedding

• Broke into the Strange’s Amulet

Power

• Broke out of a magical binding spell cast by Strange

• Ate the pan-dimensional oversight council

• Ripped out his aide’s spine without magic

• Lifted and threw Hulk with one hand

• Stated to have enough power to topple planets out of orbit

• Consistently and constantly absorbs dimensions 

• Could effortlessly defeat Clea

• Casually bested Dykors 

• Ragdolled Carol Danvers

• Shattered a magic shield from Strange with an energy beam

• Shattered the ice that had frozen around him

• Punched Strange through a building’s roof

• Could “pull reality apart like putty” alongside Umar

• Defeated Strange and Namor with a single flame blast

• Grabbed and effortlessly restrained Namor and Tiger Shark

• Overpowered and restrained Scarlet Witch

• Tore apart the very heavens in a vision by Dr. Strange

• In a fight with Dr. Strange they shook not only the Dark Dimension but it trickled back to Earth as well

• It took Strange, Surfer, Professor Hulk, Clea, and the Ghost Rider to threaten not even one tenth of Dormammu’s power 

• Boasted the combined mights of Umar, Scarlet Witch and Agatha Harkness could not match him, after having captured and restrained Gaea, while the very Earth split from his power

• Took control of the Realm Unknown, and absorbed its ruler, a reality of perpetual state of oblivion, described as having no parallel, where even time had spatial existence, and every atom is equivalent to an entire veritable universe

• Held the might to shake whole universes

• Without Dormammu’s active will to sustain it, the universe was de-merged from the Dark Dimension

• Stated by Strange to be a threat to all dimensions 

• Loki believed Dormammu capable of conquering Asgard if he gained access to the realm

• Loki was also veritably terrified of Dormammu’s presence, cowering before him in their encounters, stating even Odin had warned him of the Dread lord before

• It was stated his merging of Earth with the Dark Dimension was the greatest threat the Earth-616 universe had ever faced up until that point

• His power can affect the multiverse 

• Crashed out so hard, his mere rage threatened to destroy the whole Dark Dimension 

• Stated he could’ve killed the Avengers, but he didn’t want to alert Doctor Strange. 

• Effortlessly dispatched of Hulk, Dr. Strange, Namor, Silver Surfer, Valkyrie and Hawkeye in a single blow

• Claims to be equal to Zeus and Odin

• A fight between him and Eternity nearly killed them both

• Took part in the War of the Seven Spheres, competing against multiple mystic forces including the Vishanti

• Elder Gods that compose 2/3rds of the Vishanti like Oshtur should be comparable to her siblings Gaea and Chthon, the former having the power to match the Chaos King and restore the damaged multiverse and the latter threatened to poison the Far Shore and possibly the rest of The Outside.

Speed

• Dormammu, alongside Loki, intercepted a message sent by the Black Knight across dimensions

• Filled up an endless cosmic void faster than Strange could react

• Dormammu telekinetically stole an object so fast it outpaced various high-profile heroes included Thor, Silver Surfer, Doctor Strange, Iron Man, and Namor

Durability

• Survived his own power being turned against him

• Survived getting hit by a blast that was brighter than a thousand exploding suns and seemingly shredded the very fabric of existence.

• Survives getting sliced in the head by Darkchilde Magik

• Survives the full force of Cyclops’s maskless optic blast

• Survived after Magik absorbed the Limbo dimension into herself

• Dormammu survives a fire attack from the Mhuruuks, and claims that they possess "only a fraction of (his) might."

• Tanked a magic beam from Strange without his Dark Dimensional power

• Can create barriers that even Savage Hulk and Strange can’t break

Trigon

Overall

• Killed his people, destroyed his homeworld at age six, and conquered millions of worlds and his dimension as an adult 

• Defeated the Teen Titans and succeeded in conquering Earth with Raven at his side

• Consumed the Heart of Darkness and killed the Divine

• Ravaged dozens of universes and became their ruler

• Became a part of the hierarchy of Hell, ruling over his own dimension known as the Underrealm of the Six Kingdoms of Trigon

• In an alternate future, destroyed all of Earth’s heroes including the Teen Titans, Justice League, and the Justice Society of America

Power

• Called by his own children the most powerful demonic force the world has ever seen

• Destroyed his home planet at age 6 and is stated to be able to destroy planets

• He was stated by Raven to have torn a universe asunder

• Obliterates galaxies for fun

• No-sold the Teen Titans in their first encounter

• Caused the 1906 San Francisco earthquake

• Blew away the Titans and Justice League including Zatanna, Green Lantern and Wonder Woman 

• Tim Drake states that Trigon has the power to wipe out his team, which includes Superboy and Wonder Girl, but chose not to

• Trigon can wipe out all human life and destroy everything according to Raven

• All of Robins former allies would be powerless against Trigon

• While at a tenth of his former self, Trigon states he's still strong enough to kill Raven, destroy the Earth and the entire universe 

• Instantly created a planet wide storm that completely blots out the sun to the point no light can peek through

• Effortlessly throws Raven through a portal and snaps two of his children's necks

• Lifted and destroyed Titans Tower with telekinesis 

• Pinned Bizarro down with one hand and fought on par with him

• Killed the Three Divine in one attack after powering up

• Trigon could absorb the Heart, which had leveled universes

• Created a portal that was going to suck up the universe 

• It’s claimed that his power in the Realm of Eyes is Nigh-Omnipotent

• Easily defeated multiple heroes trying to jump him like Superman, Martian Manhunter, Swamp Thing and more

• Is implied to be comparable to Neron in power

• After Superman destabilized Lady Blazes dimension with his heat vision which causes a ripple throughout mystic dimensions, Raven stated that Trigon was capable of a similar feat, with Doctor Fate commenting on the disruption he felt in the Realm of Black Damnation 

• His clash with Raven fused with the Dark-Winged Queen and Titans created a shockwave 

• Killed Superman, the Flash and Doctor Fate among others in an alternate future where Trigon succeeded in defeating the Justice League a second time

• Trigon extinguished all life in this timeline, with only 38,000 survivors remaining in total

• While witnessing the events of Infinite Crisis, Nightwing states that it reminds him of Trigon's previous attacks on Earth (debatable given the language Nightwing uses) 

• Infinite Crisis like the various other crisis events caused ripples all the way to the Source Wall and cracked it

Speed

• Exceeded a young Wally West in speed and flew directly to Azarath, which is in the void between dimensions and exists neither in space or time (Immeasurable)

• While at a tenth of his former self, he was able to catch Raven off guard

• Caught Wonder Girl mid-flight

Durability

• Tanks hits from the entire original Teen Titans at once

• His reanimated skeleton takes a few attacks from Cyborg, Starfire and Superboy before being destroyed 

• Took a tag team attack from Bunker and Superboy, with Superboy feeling like he’s doing no damage and stating it feels like he's hitting a mountain

• Got punched by Wonder Girl so hard that it sent him flying into a school bus

• Can tank hits from Fire, Doctor Fate and Firestorm

• Survived getting jumped by Raven and several of his daughters

• Survived getting stabbed through his eyes by Tim Drake’s wings 

• Then survived ripping them out

• No sold attacks from Starfire, Cyborg and other heroes like Swamp Thing trying to restrain him

Scaling

Dormammu

Doctor Strange

The Master of the Mystic Arts, Doctor Strange is the archnemesis of the Dreaded Dormammu, and their battles have carved a path across all netherrealms. Dormammu claims his power exceeds any power Strange could muster, and in many cases, Doctor Strange has had to call upon divine help to assist him in battle to triumph against the fearsome Faltine. 

• Along with Wong, survives a horde of the Hosts of Hoggoth bringing down a bridge after Wong’s spell backfires 

• Survives getting blasted in the chest by Imogen

• Survives a blast from Wong and Mordo’s battle, Mordo in particular was using Dormammu’s magic

• Shattered Dormammu’s body across a cosmic infinity

• Pushes his way through Wong not being able to control his magic with Ukase of the Rings 

• Doctor Strange’s powers were enough to harm Daniel Ketch/Ghost Rider

• Strange reacts to (and blasts) a beam of light

• Strange’s astral form flew to and from Silver Surfer who was galaxies away

• Can transcend dimensions

• By calling upon Agamotto he was able to fight with Galactus

• Strange was able to dodge blasts from the Vashanti 

• Strange could fly fast enough to transmigrate through a singularity 

• It’s stated later that he used the singularity to travel through a rift in space-time 

• Was capable of recreating the Unreal 616 Dream Dimension that Nightmare ruled over after it was devoid of any further dreams, something backed up by how he fought Nightmare in his own realm, even causing him pain with Agamotto’s light. The Dream Dimension exists far beyond the Outer Plane and is similar in location to the Dark Dimension.

• Fired a mystic bolt which physically traveled to another dimension (Immeasurable)

• Traveled faster than “any living being has traveled before”, creating an “interdimensional road of repetition” and an endless loop, throughout “eternity” (Immeasurable)

• Held together the Nexus of All Realities for an unknown period before Man-Thing repaired it

Shuma-Gorath (Debatable)

In the past, Dormammu and Shuma-Gorath have had some battles here and there. More often than not though, Dormammu ends up at the mercy of the mighty Shuma-Gorath after being banished to his realm by Doctor Strange, so one might be uncertain if Dormammu can even begin to challenge his power. His only real victories against the beast are against inferior avatars. However, Dormammu has challenged beings in a similar realm of power before and come out on top, such as the Vishanti, the main trio of gods that empower Doctor Strange. Two of these three are Elder Gods (Oshtur and Agamotto), and the third, Hoggoth, is an Old One like Shuma-Gorath. In the Cancerverse story arc, the Great Old Ones proved they could battle and even kill Abstract beings, suggesting that at higher levels of power, Dormammu can be in a similar ballpark, though his losses against the likes of Galactus and Eternity suggest that he is outmatched in those areas as well. 

• Could battle an amped Doctor Strange, in which their battle threatened to to collapse all the nether realms

• Is in a similar ballpark of power to Eternity, above the likes of Mephisto

• Drinks the spoiled milk of dead stars

• Survived a hit from Scarlet Witch using the power of the Darkhold

• Has the potential power to break reality beyond repair

• His tentacles could restrain powerful beings like Dr. Strange or the Inbetweener

Marvel Mystics

Dormammu’s Faltine physiology is composed of pure magic, and where there is an imbalance of magic, there is bound to be a duel for the ages. Dormammu has gone toe-to-toe with many of Marvel’s best magic users, from Magik to Doctor Doom. 

Magik (someone that Dormammu has called a threat to his existence)

• Absorbs the Limbo Dimension into herself

• Can react to Thor’s hammer

Doctor Voodoo

• Went for a week without sleeping while balancing his Sorcerer Supreme and Medical Doctor life

• Survives a blast Dr. Doom’s finger lasers

• Tears off a part of Dr. Doom’s armor with his bare hands

Baron Mordo

• A tendril he generated stretched through various dimensions

• The spells he was capable of casting were described as capable of ripping a hole in the fabric of time and space

Gloriana

• Gloriana fights in hell for a long period of time

• It should be noted that Gloriana says it feels like months, but she has no idea and it just felt that way, she also does say that time does pass differently in hell

Hell Lords

With Dormammu having a comfy stone chair at the table of Hell Lords, it is reasonable to assume that Dormammu should be comparable to his fellow allies/rivals, especially those that seek the throne of Hell itself. 

Clea

• Moved at the speed of thought

• She and Strange/"Flyx" obliterated half of Aggamon's Purple Dimension

Umar

• Stated directly inferior to her brother, Dormammu’s boasted he’s stronger, and he’s destroyed her

• Has enough power to “make two universes shudder”

• Could make a storm that spans dimensions

• Scattered one of Dormammu’s love atoms across 146 universes

Satannish (is a creation of Dormammu, Dormammu claims to be superior)

• A brawl between him and Mephisto could destroy the Earth

• Feared by sentient Cosmic Cubes like Kubic & Kosmos

• An earlier Joe Fixit stated he could grow in rage as the green Savage Hulk for months and still not even come close to Satannish in power

Mephisto

• Could shatter the barriers between his realm and Satannish's

• Defeats Doctor Doom annually for the soul of Cynthia von Doom

• Stated to be the equal of a Well-Fed Galactus, with their fight threatening the universe itself

• Can harm Starbrand & Phoenix Force hosts

• A battle with Hela would cause Omniversal Armageddon that would make Ragnarok pale in comparison

• With aid from six other Hell Lords, managed to shift the cosmic axis, which is the point where the universe revolves around

Nightmare

• Nightmare created his own realm, which resides within the Astral Plane

• Defeated several Beyonders that invaded his realm

• His bond with the Collective Unconscious once allowed him to become one with the universe and surpass Universal Manifestations of Abstracts

The Defenders

Can’t forget Strange’s ragtag bunch of misfits. These guys have been through thick and thin with the Sorcerer, and even gone up against Dormammu and his forces before, even being given a challenge by them.

The Hulk

• Sent a shockwave felt throughout infinite dimensions (Infinite)

• Broke chains made of the First Firmament

• Survived being held down by the star-heavy spear of Proxima Midnight

• Survived being in a realm of infinite density

• Powered through all the Infinite Crossroads being pushed at him (Multi+)

Silver Surfer

• Could rekindle a dying star

• A clash with Morg destroyed a planet

• Annihilated a solar system

• Can travel into the future via sheer speed

• Quickly traveled half a million light years

Namor

• Ripped the arm off a sentinel

• Could fly from the ocean to space in seconds

• Could keep up with Black Bolt and Iron Man

Danny Ketch

• Stabbed Blackout in the head

• Blasts Abomination through a wall

• Could race Johnny Blaze around the planet

Trigon

Raven

The daughter of darkness herself, Raven is Trigon’s daughter and inherited his power making her the perfect weapon for the demon to use in his invasion of Earth. Trigon has faced his daughter in combat multiple times and is nearly always her superior and even when he loses to her, their confrontations are hardly an easy fight, meaning Trigon should be more than capable of anything Raven can do which is supported by them being comparable to similar threats like Neron.

• Raven's birth shook Azarath and darkened its skies

• The demonic forces within Raven are great enough to destroy a universe

• Raven states that unlike Starfire, her own power “can destroy the universe and more”

• Survived standing in a timeless void while “being assaulted by energies of a hundred thousand different dimensions" 

• While imbued with holy fire from the angel Zauriel, Raven’s soul self could ascend up to and transport the JLA to the Gates of Heaven

The Teen Titans

A team of superheroes formed by his daughter to combat him, the Teen Titans are some of the greatest heroes on Earth, stated to have power nearly without limit and yet they are nothing before the might of Trigon. In his various invasions he’s come face to face with the team and no matter the lineup the team has, Trigon ends up absolutely throttling them with little resistance. It's also worth noting that Raven is usually portrayed as the most powerful member of the Titans by a fair margin, adding consistency to Trigon dwarfing them in power.

Wally West:

• Can appear in multiple places at once

• Ran across the Earth so fast his trail appears several times at once across the globe

• Can run a billion scenarios in a nanosecond

• Is faster than Barry Allen

Starfire:

• Blasts apart a mountain

• Faced Mongul in combat

• Staggered Thia who took over Olympus and defeated Zeus

• Broke out of Supermans frost breath

• Was overwhelming Jessica Cruz's shield

Donna Troy:

• Faced the Extremists alongside Starfire, who are stated to have destroyed planets and gone toe to toe with the Justice League 

• Sent Black Adam flying 

• Could catch Jesse Quick

• Survived an attack from Monarch who stated his power was comparable to the big bang 

Cyborg:

• Can blast a zillion decibels of sound

• Could draw blood from Shazam

• Was unaffected by a Mortar shell

Beast Boy:

• Can shift between transformations at rapid speeds 

• Could evade bulletfire

• Could send Mammoth flying

The Justice League Dark

A team of supernatural individuals brought together to investigate and deal with mystical threats outside the Justice League's jurisdiction, the Justice League Dark is home to the most skilled and powerful magic users in the universe and on more than one occasion Trigon has had to deal with these heroes. The Sons of Trigon have faced off with members like Swamp Thing and Zatanna and are able to hold their own quite well. Trigon himself is shown defeating Swamp Thing alongside other heroes without much effort, blew away Zatanna while escaping his dimension and in an alternate timeline killed Doctor Fate which lead Zatanna to believe Trigon was unbeatable, suggesting that Trigon is superior to the Justice League Dark in power.

Another noteworthy thing to mention for scaling is that in the Books of Magic, a giant magical war occurs in the future across multiple timelines where the strongest magical entities and magic practitioners fight in a giant war between light and darkness. Many of the fighters in this war appear relative to one another and include Timothy Hunter, Shazam, Spectre, Klarion, Giovanni Zatara, Eclipso, Tefe Holland, John Constantine, Doctor Fate, Randu Singh, Zatanna, and Etrigan fighting one another, with it being stated that either side can/have won the conflict across different timelines, supporting the idea that much of DC’s top mystics and magical beings should be relative to one another.

Swamp Thing:

• Was expected to protect the spiritual dimensions during the Crisis on Infinite Earths 

• Defeated Wonder Woman in battle 

• Invaded the Other Place by going beyond the Green and briefly overpowered the Upside Down Man, in addition to changing his reality 

• Could expand from Hell and invaded the Dreaming beyond even Dream's capacity to remove

Doctor Fate:

• Can destroy the Sphere of the Gods alongside other Lords of Order 

• Had the Helm of Fate fly at the velocity of God which was also described as passing through quantum singularities into realms of dialectical space and meta-time 

• Reinforced a shield to contain the Upside Down Mans power 

• Was able to casually defeat Darkseid with only half of their power (Landa's Doctor Fate)

Zatanna:

• Should upscale weaker magic users like Thessaly, who can collapse the pillars of Heaven & Hell

• Can tear the universe apart 

• Could match Simon Baz in a beam clash

• Can move the Sun

• Defeated Zor, a time tailor and enemy of the Spectre 

John Constantaine:

• Could make a small sun

• Could pull the Phantom Stranger across space and time

• Knows a spell powerful enough to kill a God 

Deadman:

• Survives a hit from Pantheon

• Could fly around the Earth in a short time

The Quintessence

A group of cosmic beings meant to watch over all of creation including members such as the New God Highfather, the Green Lantern Ganthet and even the Angel of Gods Wrath the Spectre. Despite their incredible power, Trigon should be reasonably capable of challenging their might. It's stated the Quintessence can't risk a confrontation with Trigon and his forces from hell. The Phantom Stranger has encountered the Sons of Trigon a few times and is implied to be comparable to them by facing them in an intense game of poker or Belial feeling confident enough to break into his house and threaten him. When Anton Arcane received an amp (don't ask), the Monitor stated that the energy could only be either Trigon or the Spectre, directly comparing the two in power. To add consistency to scaling to the Spectre, The Dark-Winged Queen defeated the Spectre in battle with minimal effort and after this Raven merged with the Dark-Winged Queen in order to take on Trigon, meaning Trigon should be on a similar level to the Spectre and thus the rest of the Quintessence. Given the nature of the Quintessence, this would naturally upscale them over almost anyone in the Sphere of The Gods so scaling to miscellaneous gods who aren’t definitively stronger than the Quintessence nor Trigon is fair game.

The Spectre:

• Can defy time and distance 

• States his power is almost limitless

• Sent a punch flying across the universe 

• Stated to be stronger than Phantom Stranger by The Batman Who Laughs

• Even while weakened by the combined efforts of the Sentinels of Magic, Spectre-Asmodel was still stronger than the Phantom Stranger

• The Hindu God Shiva is just an aspect of The Spectre

• Very briefly fought and clashed with Michael Demiurgos, but lost decisively (See Before The Verdicts)

• The Spectre should upscale virtually every weaker angel and such feats as:

• Angels seeing distance & time as illusions and can fly across realms in just one panel

• The Heavenly Host could fly across the Void chasing after Lucifer

• A younger Elaine Belloc killing The Green of Lucifer's Cosmos

• Four unnamed angels could fly across the entirety of The Presence’s Creation to enfold and carry it, dropping it into Elaine Belloc’s Creation

The Phantom Stranger:

• Killed a Mayan god of death

• Can project himself and Tim Hunter to the beginning of time

• Bloodied the Spectre with a punch and can fight on par with him. Their battle is stated to be able to destroy all of creation

• More powerful than Etrigan and stood unharmed by his onslaught

Highfather:

• Flew to the Source Wall

• Is considered the strongest of the New Gods due to his bond to the Source

• Threatened to end all of existence due to his defeat at the hands of Darkseid 

• Contributed 1/5th to the Cinque of Power which destroyed a dimension and held off the Anti-Life Entity 

Zeus & Hera:

• Zeus fought and defeated the Hawaiian God Kane Milohai, who can create universes

• Zeus has fought and clashed evenly with a younger Darkseid. Darkseid drained Zeus’ energy to restore him to his former self, something he couldn't accomplish with Wonder Woman and her siblings 

Ganthet:

• Blocked the Big Bang with a shield

• Scales to his fellow Guardians. The Guardians of the universe:

• Are stated to possess power similar to the Big Bang 

• Are powerful enough to destroy all universes

• Held back Sinestro Corps War Anti-Monitor  

All:

• Stated to be able to easily kill a wounded Darkseid individually 

• Exist at the level of the Sphere of the Gods 

Misc. Sphere of The Gods Denizens:

• The Wild Hunt tore through the Realms of Order and the Lords of Order were too afraid to confront them

• The Hunted God could run through every forest in every dimension

• Hermes ran across multiple dimensions being chased by the Furies, ending up in the Dreaming

• Gods of Skartis could create the universe, exist simultaneously across multiple planes of existence, and displace space-time just by existing

• Odin made/had a hand in making the main DC universe

• After devouring the Phantom Zone and further devouring all of history, Mr. Mind creates Hyperflies the size of the emerging Earths' Hypertime branches that would have left all creation to rot in mindless darkness

• Loki shakes the world with his cries

• Minor Titans like Gyges and Garamas could trace and walk across the shape of God from the empty space He left behind after leaving the multiverse determining its size, its contours, and where it touches that which it is not

Lords of Hell

Trigon’s lineage includes that of Etrigan the Demon and his father Belial, both of which are some of Hell’s strongest warriors. [Cardinal include more sentences here if you can]

Misc. Demons

• Musubi, a Shinto demon, could kill numerous angels and fend off multiple of them at once, only being killed when an Archangel arrived.

• Cerberus, the guard dog of Hell, briefly overpowered Superman

Neron:

• Fought several of Earth's best magic users at once including Alan Scott, Doctor Fate and Zatanna 

• Can control Hells structure which is subject to Neron's rules

• Hell is the opposite of Heaven which is a higher order of reality

• Tanked an attack from Apollo

First of The Fallen:

• Capable of killing The Green and The Red

• Easily killed Rosacarnis, who was relative to the Phantom Stranger

• Put a curse on and is treated as more powerful than John Constantine to where only The Presence could save him

• His armor let Supergirl briefly fight Doomsday and take no major hits after he’d been amped as a contender for being King in Hell

Lady Blaze:

• Blaze has limitless power within Hell

Etrigan:

• Tanked a 5 Megaton bomb (5 Megatons of TNT)

• Punched Superman to the moon

• His very existence threatens Chaos and the Balance it maintains with Order 

• Stalemated with Lobo

• Overpowered a demon overpowering Wonder Woman and is stated to be stronger than her even while Jason Blood can't use Etrigan's body properly

• Jason is explicitly not as strong as Etrigan while controlling his body given that Etrigan in Jason’s body easily defeated Lancelot, who was able to overpower Jason in Etrigan’s body

• While wielding Excalibur, slew a hellhound-transformed New-52 Lucifer and Belial after he’d connected himself to the main Earth for power

The Endless (DEBATABLE)

The Endless, one of the most powerful families of the DC Multiverse that represent seven concepts important to the very structure of Creation… and yet aren’t necessarily the end-all be-all of cosmic powers. While true that the things they embody affect nearly all of DC Cosmology, the Endless themselves have been pushed and challenged from time to time. Dream notably was once defeated and usurped as Dream King by unnamed random gods early in the universe’s history. During the events of Sandman: Overture, Dream is overpowered and forcefully pushed into a conceptual black hole by several Stars. Minor angels like Meleos and half-angels like the Lilim could fight with and stall The Basanos, replicas of Destiny's very book, and had an actual chance at victory if it weren't for the Basanos’ probability manipulation. Dream was incredibly weary of going to war with Heaven or the Unseelie of the Fair Folk. 

There’s also the idea that Trigon, being a Lord of Hell, should be boosted while within Hell as it is with other beings like Eclipso while fighting in their domains and such authority is comparable to that of The Endless. Being Lord of Hell and the powers of minor gods like Eriti is considered comparable to The Endless, Lords of Chaos & Order, and the Angels. Former Triumvirate of Hell member, Azazel, stood a chance against Dream if they fought anywhere else except the Dreaming. Death herself admits that not even she has authority or can intervene in others' domains despite her being usually except from following the rules. So even if he doesn’t scale directly to the Endless in stats, his authority in Hell either boosts him against, nullifies the power of beings invading Hell to such an extent, or is just comparable to their feats in their own realms.

• The Endless can casually make and shape universes

• Individual totems belonging to Dream of The Endless could hold their own against the dark alter ego of WAN, the Dream King after Dream had left the multiverse

• WAN by this point could spin a web across the entire Collective Unconscious that was going to collapse it over time

• With just the Dreamstone in the hands of Doctor Destiny damaged the Dreaming in his fight with Dream and made Destiny of the Endless afraid to turn the next page of his book.

• Death's Ankh can break down the barriers separating worlds and create black holes

• The Endless deform reality just by existing or moving

• Even after taking the castle of the Dreaming and were empowered to where they could rip the Dreaming apart from its roots, the Kindly Ones still ran from Death of The Endless

• Without being empowered by vengeance, Dream easily defeats the Kindly Ones

• The Kindly Ones can overpower Old Gods like Janus, who briefly terrorized denizens of the Fifth Dimension

• Dream can dispel and kill Dream Vortexes, which can collapse the Dreaming

• Death of The Endless is the "ultimate death" who will claim even the Black Racer and Nekron

• The Black Racer could kill an amped Darkseid, who fought an Anti-Monitor that was just as powerful as his COIE self

• Death could slap Lobo off of her

Cosmology

Quick Disclaimer

You may notice that Dormammu’s section for Cosmology here will be a bit shorter than Trigon’s so we’ll quickly explain here. To avoid unnecessary clutter, we are only really going to go over the bits of cosmology that would apply to Dormammu in terms of scaling, as anything higher wouldn’t really be necessary. DC’s on the other hand will be much more extensive and go over cosmology that does and doesn’t apply to Trigon. This is because for the purposes of this blog, we wanted to look at cosmology from the ground up again, and examine the more left field areas such as the writings of J.M. DeMatteis and of the Vertigo imprint, so lots of the findings here are just for show, and we will label the cut-off that doesn’t apply to Trigon. This has no bearing on the verdict, so please do not say we downplayed Dormammu or didn’t even try for him or we will just send you a screenshot of this disclaimer to make you look silly. If you want to read a full extensive breakdown of the Marvel cosmology, please read our previous blog, Vecna vs Doctor Doom, as well as G1’s Doctor Strange vs Reimu that a few of us worked on.

Marvel Comics

The Fininite/Infinite Universes

The universe is quite the big place, with more stars and planets than anyone can really grasp a picture of. In real life, the observable universe as we know it spans about 93 billion light-years in diameter and theories range to basically any finite number above that all the way to infinity. Marvel’s universe isn’t dissimilar from that, in that we have statements of the universe being at least a trillion light-years in radius, having its population of centillions of living beings insinuating that the size is up to 100 Octooctogintilion times larger than our universe, and with cosmically attuned characters stating it’s infinite, with it also being stated that an infinite number of galaxies exist in the universe, where mystic plans exist in this world.

In more recent times, the universe has seemed to only get larger. According to Galactus, an alt. Earth that an evil Sue Storm is from exists within the Earth-616 universe as part of the expanded region of space after the Reckoning War, where the universe was restored to its original size of being 10x larger than what we’d seen up until now. Per Reed, another Earth exists within their own universe because “with enough space–and enough time–random fluctuations dictate that every possible structure must be formed!” In fact it’s more than just infinite, but trans-finite in size, lacking borders or outer edges. And that’s all just referring to 3-D space. Like our universe Marvel’s universe has a temporal dimension to it, but Marvel takes it further by suggesting that the 4th dimension is a part of a congruence of spheres where each is nestled inside the other in an infinite convergent series.

The Multiverse

From Dr. Strange himself, we learn that there are an infinite number of dimensions, and that a number of dimensions greater than infinity exists. Beyond that, we start reaching the higher, numbered spatial dimensions. There is a 5th Dimension, the 6th Dimension, the 11 Dimensions of String Theory, a 12th, 13th, 16th, 18th, hundreds of levels of reality, thousands of planes of reality, and even an endless number of dimensions. Cosmic beings can ascend and do battle on countless levels of reality, each layered on top of one another in an infinite stack of spatial dimensions with each infinitely larger than the last. It may even be a trans-finite stack of higher dimensions to wave functions containing all possible worlds, with the multiverse including at least a population up to a googolplex of lives. Across an impossible distance and at the very edge of the universe is The Rip, an event line where all space, time, matter, and energy run out and collapse, where the laws of physics no longer apply. All space, time, and dimensions meet here before moving beyond the cosmic threshold.

The Astral Plane

The Astral Plane, the domain of Oshtur, contains and exists beyond physical space as a realm of idea, thought, and narrative. A substrate of the 616, abstractions of the mind are contained and represented here as a loci of informational potential in an infinite psychic matrix where physical matter struggles to endure without mental strength. It contains an infinite gray space that acts as the bedrock layer to the infinite reaches of the Astral Plane. In this idea-space, one can see that all creatures are intrinsically connected in the abstract, not dissimilar from a hive mind and can even be seen as a single entity. It contains whole timelines and multiverses in potential. It is the bedrock layer of creation from which an infinite number of layers of reality extend upwards from it. This extradimensional plane is not an afterlife, despite what first impressions may be, as it’s actually a “subtle realm” with intra-dimensional depths that connects to the Dark Dimension.

More specifically, the Astral Plane is a metaphysical dimension layered on top of the main universe, as in layered atop our reality, with Astral Projection being akin to ascension. It’s a phantom plane of existence parallel to ours, held apart by a membrane, which sorcerers can use to mess with the baseline reality from the Astral Plane. The reason they can do this is because the Astral Plane is beyond this plane of reality, accessible by dimensional folds. Further elaboration states that “beyond” is in reference to how this plane is beyond the boundaries of our reality, a plane of existence just beyond the baseline reality.

The Astral Plane is also just one part of the Inner Planes, which contain many of the mythological realms and afterlives, and a sister Elder God’s realm the Otherworld, which is connected to a myriad number of realities across the multiverse and integral to the maintenance of the multiversal structure.

The Outer Planes

Also referred to as the Consecution of Colors, this section of existence is where the physical laws give way to colorful abstraction. The Inner Planes are separated from the Outer Planes by Brona’s Barrier, which renders the latter as totally inaccessible to the former even in spirit form and requires a great difficulty crossing even with the aid of powerful sorcerers. Only the creator of the Bifrost could connect the two planes together after the sacrifice of two souls to create the Prismatic Bridge of Asbru. Many of the cosmos’ mightiest cosmic beings have domains here such as Cyttorak and his Crimson Cosmos and the Purple Dimension ruled by Aggamon. The Vishanti's domain is also somewhere here. While we don’t really have statements regarding the sizes of the realms of the Outer Planes besides their cosmological position, we do know that their residents can dwarf the universe itself as is the case with Cyttorak literally being able to hold the universe over his head in the conclusion of Eight Deaths of Spider-Man. 

The Splinter Realms

To expand more on Limbo’s cosmic importance we’ll have to briefly discuss The Splinter Realms, as Limbo exists as the very center of these hellish dimensions. When Hell-Lords are called upon from the Splinter Realms, it is described as them being summoned from the boundless twilight that holds sway beyond the frayed edges of existence. Beyond the cosmic confines of mere consciousness. It exists beyond the Outer Planes, being born when an unknown but massive plane of existence had shattered and each of its fragments became the realms that form the Splinter Realms, and later the underworlds of various mythologies would be counted among these dimensions. Many of the original rulers of each of these realms were born from the collective Primal Evil early in Earth’s existence, with humanity’s collective beliefs and stories forming and shaping the individuality of the many devils we know today plague the Marvel universe such as Mephisto and Satannish, but they all still share/split the same worship and belief in the collective belief of a single lord of evil. All these realms are separated by endless walls from one another, though as shown by Mephisto they can be tunneled/broken through.

As with the Inner and Outer Planes, physics don’t really exist in the Splinter Realms. Gravity doesn’t exist as it’s known on Earth, and just like Limbo, time moves in different ways across these realms. The Dark Dimension, the largest fragment of that original Splinter Realm, is stated to possess more spatial dimensions than man’s universe and exists beyond the trans-finite multiverse, and the Faltine contains even more than the Dark Dimension. Mephisto’s domain, The Lower Depths, is a whole universe containing planets and galaxies and is also stated to be beyond concepts that already exist outside man’s understanding as an untouchable, paradoxical realm. Nightmare’s Dream Dimension is quite literally a direct manifestation of the collective psyche, straddling the line between the Splinter Realms and the Far Realms. The Devil’s Advocacy exists where all the infernal domains intersect with one another on the metaphysical plane, acting as the meeting place between Hell-Lords to discuss their schemes. The Dark Dimension is the largest of the Splinter Realms of which there are thousands, and is called The “Multiverse-spanning”. And, Limbo is the center of the Splinter Realm, which transcends all realities and interfaces with all planes of existence. From Limbo, you can access all time and space, the whole of creation itself.

The Dream Dimension

While sometimes the Dream Dimension is stated as linking to humanity’s collective unconscious, Nightmare himself says there are an infinite number of powerful realms, and Strange semi-confirms this by saying Nightmare wants to take over every physical and metaphysical realm. Nightmare calls the Dream Dimension an “endless expanse”, one where he can conjure infinite hallways, all of which contain astral seas. The Dream Dimension itself exists far beyond the Outer Planes in a closeby, similar location to the Dark Dimension. This would mean, much like the Dark Dimension, this would be multiverse-spanning, and it exists beyond the perceptions of time and space.

And, this realm, as mentioned earlier, straddles the line between the Splinter Realms and the Far Realms. This is supported by how Nightmare’s influence was increasing the ebb and flow between his dimension and the main one, threatening to bleed over. And, Nightmare is a conceptual entity, as much a part of all existence as Eternity himself, which is important as dreams as a general thing that exists can cease to exist or be recreated within the Dream Dimension when it’s manipulated. And, because Nightmare’s conceptual body is composed of the essence of the Dream Dimension, this would imply that it’s “unreal”, since his body had an “unreal” nature that needed to be actualized to be attackable and absorbable.

The Superflow

But, beyond all that are the Universal Abstracts, embodiments of the wider cosmos manifesting at a more local, universal level. Each of these entities are conceptual beings embodying fundamental ideas at a level beyond our understanding. Even infinite-dimensional beings and sentient universes like the infant Beyonder are viewed as insignificant to said Abstracts and higher level mystical beings, “only” on the level of partial incarnations akin to shadows of their true form. All reality is transcended even by just the Manifestation Bodies of Abstracts, of which an Abstract may possess a trans-finite number of such M-Bodies. What is visible of Universal Abstracts is merely the iceberg of cosmic dimensions. In truth, they have no dimensions at all, lacking boundaries entirely.

The divider between realities and full scope of the eighth iteration of the multiverse is only really seen when you look outwards and see the Superflow, a conceptual and informational space acting as the walls between alternate timelines, of which there are infinite in number. It acts as a dimensional conduit composed of “pure information”. And, it’s an arterial dimensional between-space, an otherspace that exists between the universes of the multiverse and connects them, where conceptual abstracts reside and make war with one another with metaphors. From the smallest quark to the largest space god, creation is fundamentally made from information in a space where dreams are made from. If one were to break down the Superflow, one would turn the multiverse into a universe, not unlike the First Firmament that started the cosmic cycle. Conversely, information fortifies the Superflow and empowers Abstracts and Eternity’s being. The Superflow is also impossibly vast and difficult to manipulate, as hosts to universal manifestations of The Phoenix Force and wielders of the Infinity Gauntlet have died attempting to bridge the gap between universes or merge timelines together.

On this note, we should also address the nature of how Abstracts manifest within universes vs multiversal manifestations. The full multiversal incarnation of Abstracts like Eternity stand above any universal incarnation of other Abstracts. For another (albeit potentially dubiously canon) example, the Brothers representing the Marvel and DC universes were treated unambiguously as above The Living Tribunal of that universe, but the multiversal manifestation of the Tribunal held them effortlessly within his hand, treated as merely parts of the greater scheme of things that the Living Tribunal oversaw.

Eternity

Containing all the previous universes, bulk spaces, spiritual realms, and layers would naturally be the wider omniverse. So, what kind of vessel embodies everyone, everything, all levels of creation, and defines reality as a reflection of his consciousness? This would be Eternity, who is essentially the idea that all of creation is actually just one giant, godlike guy. Sporting an infinite consciousness, various locations throughout time and space operate as his vital organs. For example, Earth itself acts as Eternity’s heart, which is why detonating it is often a cosmic threat, and the Superflow behaves as a form of Eternity’s mind. His body is the embodiment and manifestation of all things, including ever-expanding quantum spacetime, magic, worlds within worlds, dimensions folding into themselves, universes being born, all energy, all matter, and the void that precedes the birth of form, which is only a fraction of Eternity. He contains all of the conceptual abstract beings within himself as the sum of all of them, putting him at the top of the cosmic abstract power hierarchy, but below the Living Tribunal. Because of how all-encompassing Eternity is, sometimes when a character claims the universe is in danger, they mean that Eternity is in peril from the current threat since he’s the manifestation of the life force of the universe. Characters that planned to absorb Eternity’s essence end up ruling over all of creation, gaining the power to rewrite it to their image.

This isn’t all, though. Doctor Strange claims that, via his mystic studies, he’s learned that the reality within Eternity is like a “cosmic dream and fantasy” compared to what’s outside of him. This is backed up by numerous statements, where existence within Eternity is likened to dreams and beings within Eternity are mere flickering thoughts in his endless consciousness. One time, to support all of this, Doctor Strange was falling beyond space, time, dreams, thought, life, and death before finally landing by Eternity. Eternity himself refers to reality being, but a dream and dreams are binding, every soul is a part of him and, furthermore, he is a cell of a higher multiversal Eternity, a cosmic lineage stretching back to the first story. The Eternity Mask itself is a living piece of our reality, as in Eternity. There’s mentions of four dimensions of time, with all of this being “narrative”. Every story is a piece of the whole, and everything is made of narrative. As an entity, Eternity is beyond the bounds of reality, being beyond time, space, and transcends all levels of reality and dream, making him the “most powerful entity in the multiverse”. In fact, characters usurping Eternity transcend to a higher plane of existence.

The Far Shore

At the farthest point of all life, death, and Eternity, outside the cycles of the cosmos, one finds The Far Shore, at the border before reaching The Mystery. Also heavily associated with the Nordic Yawning Void, Ginnungagap, it is the great unending nothingness that has existed since the beginning of creation, only the abyss. It is the great nothing that birthed the very threads of creation. Past iterations of the cosmos upon their “death” pass on or retreat into the Far Shore, with this space being associated with Oblivion. It is a void of absence, where “there” has no meaning there exists a nothingness deeper than death. It is within the Far Shore that iterations of the Cosmos rise and fall, occupying the same dimensional plane as the full scope of Multi-Eternity whose expansion takes up more and more space of the Oblivion Void. It is still large enough though that an aspect of Oblivion, Amatsu-Mikaboshi or The Chaos King, resided and embodied a portion of this endless primordial void before the birth of the universe where the first Elder Gods wandered and established their realms and was considered the Anti-God and void to which Eternity was defined by, and fighting the Chaos King meant fighting Eternity himself.

As one of our major addendums to Vecna vs Doctor Doom’s Marvel Cosmology section, the Oblivion Void is indeed intended to be written the same as the Far Shore (imgur backup here) and not a higher void. While it wouldn’t affect tiering overall for Marvel Cosmology due to the Dimension of Manifestations consistently being portrayed as really high up in the Outside, Oblivion's full realm explicitly isn't part of that, it is below the Upper Realms/The Outside.

Overspace

Overspace is the meeting place of cosmic Abstracts and the “home” of naturally-occuring Abstracts like Dominions, which are beings or collectives that have reached such a high level of intelligence or perform such an incredible feat or evolution they undergo apotheosis and reach Overspace. Typically, this location is visualized as a white void where you can find all of the Abstracts, including Eternity and sometimes the Living Tribunal. Yet again, it is described as above The Beyond and is unbound by the linearity and time that limits Beyonders. But its spiritual aspects aren’t to be ignored as souls that have passed on also flow through Overspace before moving onto the higher spheres of creation (though potential spiritual/informational vivisection on the way may be very unpleasant). It doesn’t simply exist as a layer atop the Macroverse given what we’ve seen of the latter’s farthest edges, with it also being stated to be above and apart from the Macroverse and other parts of reality entirely,with the Macroverse being a plane of existence wherein all the universes and layers are viewed as dreams folded inside dreams, each universe a thought contained within a larger thought, and itself containing many smaller thoughts within itself, ad-infinitum, nauseam, and hoc, something vouched for by cosmic beings like the Silver Surfer.

Overspace is also known by its other name: “The Junction to Everywhere”, a name shared by The Crossroads. But unlike that realm, which we know to have been created by an Elder God in the Seventh Cosmos, The Junction to Everywhere’s creation is attributed to the Sixth Cosmos, the Inventor of Science (also stated as such in the Storm scan). And given the inherent magic nature of its adjacent realm, The Well Beyond Worlds, and science’s opposition to it as seen in G.O.D.S, this is the likely domain of The-Natural-Order-of-Things, the Abstract embodying science and pursuit of knowledge itself.

Nexus of All Realities

When the Book of Life is opened and we are told the history of Creation (though it comes with the disclaimer that parts of it may be myth or allegory, but its essence is still true regardless): There were universes, realities, Earths, and even past iterations of humankind and other races existed before this one, but within the Dream of Time did these universes eventually came to die as the Creator grew tired of his creations and called everything back to themselves, plunging everything into the Sea of Nothingness. After slumbering in a deep and dreamless sleep, a "Whim" emerged from their divine unconscious. They would dream of darkness and light, love and hate, male and female, and life and death all as God would dream themselves into the dream and play every role as to complete and fulfill herself. The dream took form as God's hand reached out for their staff and from its light God's dream took form. This was the birth of the Fallen Stars, living embodiments of a divine thought or feeling that each play a unique role in the drama of Creation. Stars, planets, and galaxies emerged as one planet, the Earth, was assigned the very Heart and Soul of God's Dream.

As the Earth began to cool and landmasses formed, the Fallen Star Cleito was born as the Mother of All Things and the Illusion itself given substance. From her loins would come her mate and the First Man, who would be the only being in all universes to be aware that Creation was nothing more than a Dream; acknowledging he was Dream and Dreamer both. This man was Adam K'ad-Mon, First Man of The Lineage who would maintain the Dream as without him all would dissolve, dissipate, and fade into memory. The place where the Staff of God formed all creation would be known as the Nexus of All Realities, the point where every universe came together.

The Lineage and descendants of K'ad-Mon would carry on and follow in Adam's duty until the passage of time caused them to delve deep into the Illusion and forget their purpose in the holy play, the divine drama. The Fallen Stars, unable to break the Men of Lineage out of the Illusion, would have dire consequences for all in the Creator's Dream. This all culminates in Ted Sallis, the Man-Thing and current Man of Lineage, to rupture the Nexus of All Realities and nearly cause the undreaming of the dream. Only when boosted by the power of love itself could Ted Sallis survive the end of creation and restore everything alongside his son.

Aside from being a creation-spanning construct, the Nexus is simply massive. It contains every single permutation of reality imaginable, "All Possible Worlds", containing even the Fallen Stars whose existences predate time itself. Even shattered into fragments, the Nexus fuels existence and are acausal, shards having always existed in past and future and were both simultaneously in the Nexus and the places they were shattered in. Almost all beings, even The Fallen Stars, were unaware they were part of the Dream and bound by it, with Termineus and Men of Lineage being the exceptions and could step outside it, but are still fundamentally encapsulated by it as the destruction of the Nexus means their destruction as well.

But this story only tells the tale of one Nexus, the Nexus found in the Florida Everglades. Other Nexus exist across the world, with the other one of major note being the M’kraan Crystal. While it possesses numerous origins myths and stories, the current narrative as featured in Avengers Academy: Marvel’s Voices implies that it is destined to be built retroactively from the future into the past by the Demiurge-To-Come, the future versions of Wiccan and Speed. It is reality’s base code, akin to firmware where the rules of time, space, and magic are written, the very structure of creation. It protects from the chaos beyond reality, The Gorath.

Back to the crystal, it exists simultaneously and uniquely across all realities and thus facilitates travel across all realities and time, for it exists everywhere all at once and even beyond that. The M’kraan Crystal even contains the White Hot Room itself, further emphasizing how truly far in scope the Nexus of All Realities is. All fragments of the M’kraan Crystal are the main crystal itself, as the crystal cannot subdivide and each fragment can fully represent the whole. This also has the downside of that if even a single version of the crystal is shattered in one reality, that’s tantamount to destroying the M’kraan Crystal/Nexus itself and bringing an end to the entire multiverse. It has been compared directly to the Florida Everglades' Nexus.

How Does Dormammu Scale To All Of This?

For the low end, it's pretty easy to explain. The Dark Dimension is Dormammu’s domain, one that he can bend to his will and use as an all out attack or absorb into him. And as we know, the Dark Dimension is one of the many Splinter Realms, making it comparable to Limbo, which transcends all realities and interfaces with all planes of existence, and Limbo also parallels the Neutral Zone, which is the border of Eternity itself. So with the Inner Planes < Outer Planes < Splinter Realms < Superflow in mind, Dormammu would already reach four layers of Outerversal. 

For the mid end, Dormammu took part in the War of the Seven Spheres, competing against multiple mystic forces including the Vishanti. The Vishanti is made up of Oshtur, an Elder God like Gae and Chthon, with the former being able to match the Chaos King and restore the damaged multiverse and the latter threatening to poison the Far Shore and possibly the rest of The Outside. The third member of the Vishanti, Hoggoth, is an Old One, the same race as Shuma-Gorath, who can fight and kill Abstracts, granting an additional fifth layer of Outerversal over the Eighth Cosmos. 

At the absolute highest end, Dormammu is comparable to Doctor Strange, who has an insanely powerful feat of holding together the Nexus of All Realities for an unknown period before Man-Thing repaired it, with the Nexus extending its reach across not just all realities, but the White Hot Room itself, and is apart of the Land of Couldn’t-Be-Shouldn’t-Be, both of which transcend Overspace, putting Dormammu at the absolute possible highest arguments at multiple layers into High Outerversal. 

For more explanation, please read the Verdict.

DC Comics

DISCLAIMER: THERE ARE LOTS OF CHANGES TO THE COSMOLOGY THAT WE AGREED SHOULD BE TALKED ABOUT, BUT THIS DOES NOT MEAN WE ARE BUFFING EVERY DC “HERALD” TO OUTERVERSAL, PLEASE USE COMMON SENSE AND READ THIS CAREFULLY, WE ARE REASONABLE HUMAN BEINGS AND WE ASSUME YOU THE READERS ARE TOO, USE CRITICAL THINKING AND DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHERE IDK RED TORNADO WOULD GO ON THE SCALING TOTEM POLE, OTHERWISE PLEASE SPARE US FROM YOUR UNEDUCATED OPINION OR WE WILL SIMPLY POST THE ADAM WARLOCK MEME
-Bang ♥️

The Universe

A single universe in DC is at least 100 Trillion Light-Years across, expanding at rates that would put it at Nonillions of light-years in diameter, with it being stated that it may simply be infinite in size and still expanding. Universes are stated to contain multiple higher spatial dimensions, ranging from half a dozen more than humans can observe (10-D), 11, 12.3, and 19-D. More recent statements have stated that there are countless angles and layers of existence, and the absolute highest we can get is there being an infinite number of dimensions. To expand upon this, the DC universes themselves are described as countless, where time creates itself in a myriad of vectors, with these vectors being folded into any number of spatial dimensions. The universe is fundamentally membranous and quantum vacuums float beneath the sea of higher spatial dimensions capable of swallowing the universe whole.

Universes also appear to contain metaphysical layers to them such as High Space, stated to be the backstage of the universe where all the cameras and props are stored, where all iterations of the universe are made and sustained and each one containing its own Shining Tower or Chaos Engine (more on those later in the Order & Chaos section). High Space is in a higher dimension from ours and existing in multiple dimensions at once. High Space is the superstructure of space-time and from within the Shining Tower that sustains it all possibilities and past and future iterations of the universe exist all at once. It is metaphysical in nature, albeit stated explicitly to be composed of wave functions and operates under physics and mathematics and can be affected by Eternity Girl, whose entire power set is affecting wave functions and intrinsic fields and let her fuse and become one with the tower and be every universe that had ever been across countless cycles of reality, reducing the universe into a boundless darkness deeper than a void.

Within each universe also contains multiple adjacent realms and dimensions. This is where we can find places like Azarath, “a realm beyond” existing in the void between dimensions, accessible through a "moment of time, between the worlds and dimensions and here and now and then and will be".

Quick Clarification: In layman’s terms, a vector is a force being exerted into any direction. There are an infinite number of possible directions, ergo there is an infinite number of vector forces. These vector forces are infinite dimensional so long as there is an infinite number of vectors within it.

Orrery of Worlds

In the aftermath of Alexander Luthor’s dastardly plans to destroy the Prime Earth, the fallout of his actions caused the reforming Earth Prime to begin replicating into an additional fifty-one timelines: the birth of the Orrery of Worlds. Each timeline occupies the same space on a different vibrational plane.

Following the Death Metal event, the number of worlds within the multiverse expanded to being an infinite number of multiverses, an Infinite Frontier and following that the return of the Pre-Crisis Earths at the conclusion of Death Metal . In the Pre-Crisis era, the multiverse would be described as infinitely layered.

Wonderworld & The Speed Force Wall

According to the Multiversity Map, the Speed Force Wall is the limit to matter, equated with the Speed of Light itself. Despite coming from the larger concept of the Speed Force, the wall itself has only been seen visibly once. Wonderworld is the very limit of space and time accessible by traveling across the Speed Force Wall / ”faster than light speeds". From the perspective of Wonderworld, beyond it lies only the abyss, unable to perceive higher realms. Of more minor note, there are other spaces that divide the physical realms from the metaphysical ones, such as the Hollow or Reality Stream, a space outside the corner of our eyes that acts as a realm between the waking world and the Dreaming.

Heroverse

Beyond the Speed Force Wall is the Heroverse, a realm of "Metaphysical Potential" containing the potential for good and evil in all heroes and villains. It contains their "Secret Origins", i.e. the very moment an individual chooses Hope or Despair and connects to the Heroverse and is assigned to either its Light or Dark hemisphere. From here, the multiverse is looked down upon like comic panels and could only be accessed by going beyond the Speed Force Wall, but beneath The Sphere of The Gods. Everyone and everything has or can have a Secret Origin. However the Heroverse is just one part of a far larger structure known as the Multiverse Dial… which we’ll get to later in its own section.

The Sphere of The Gods

Known by many as the home of the New Gods such as Darkseid and Orion, the Sphere of The Gods, also called the Far Realms, is a metaphysical layer higher than the Heroverse and where many of the true forms of DC’s mythological, fantasy, and religious entities reside. It exists layers of abstraction separated from reality and separate from physical being as a mental realm. Things exist there that simultaneously are and are not. To its denizens, time is seen as an ocean to sail across or swim on for fun without concern. Realms here exist outside of time and are not "places" so to speak. “Directions” in the Sphere of The Gods are "unimaginable directions" such as the longitude of disaster and latitude of fate. They exist outside the laws of physics and reason. Time doesn't exist in the sphere of the gods. All of the universe is just a dream, with the Sphere of the Gods being a "deeper" dream. But there are dreams beyond it with each dream the vital things between you and the divine creator. It is difficult to assign hierarchies at the level of such gods as it’s akin to measuring a circle starting from anywhere. They exist deeper than myth and matter, the stuff of being itself that exist as cyclical ideas.

Gods from this plane like Darkseid have described it as outside corporeal reality as part of an Ultra-Multiversal space, where gods are platonic living ideas from an archetypal world. Gods are self-aware ideas who use concept-weapons and their emanations into lower reality were akin to merely being the idea of the god as opposed to the god incarnate. It is a higher, vibratory world where gods are ever-ruling, able to strike across millions of moments in Hypertime.

Gods are formed from the existence of certain concepts streaming from the Divine Presence given substance by faith or belief, and as long as either a concept exists and sufficient belief is behind it, then gods will live on. For instance, "The Hunted God" came into existence when the first being consumed another, and the story either is so old it became true or that it's a truth so old that it became a story. The Wild Hunt are composed of gods with similar origins, coming into existence the first time a living thing does a new action such as when the first victim realized what it was like to be hunted, a code of conduct/license to kill was invented, or when the first chunk of matter was drawn toward another when gravity was born. There are more examples like the realm of the Faerie representing the concept of Aspiration, its structure made of pure magic and all its inhabitants being sentient spells that are found in grimoires or how major Fairies like Mab have their hearts made out of nightmares and receive tribute from despairing dreams.

All gods and pantheons rely on the nourishment of belief to exist, literally starving and their realms decaying if people do not think of or worship them. What’s needed to sustain denizens of the Sphere of The Gods however is relatively very little. The goddess Bast was sustained even without direct worship. In her case, as long as there are cats and men to take care of them, she will remain. Calling out a god's name from the heart is heard across aeons by a god. The Shinto pantheon somehow managed to assimilate icons and altars to fuel them in place of worship, such as Marilyn Monroe, King Kong, and Lady Liberty. But even without any form of worship, gods and mythologies take a long time to die, continuing to reside in a dream country and affecting the world. Festival, a realm that exists at the conjunction of numerous realms, is formed from and sustained by the flow of music from all realms. Its creator, the Muse Terpsichore, could rebirth herself if it were ever destroyed.

And as gods represent concepts, their deaths in turn affect those concepts and the very fabric of existence. Myths grow from the root of men's souls, embodied as a cosmic lotus with all mythic realms being petals on the lotus, constantly unfolding in a never-ending blossoming of beliefs, lives, deaths, and rebirths. All myths exist in the subconscious where altered thoughts risk poisoning the soul and twisting myths, causing them to bleed into the world of man. More major gods are literally these realms themselves, as the underworld of Patala is literally a part of Vishnu himself as an example. Authority over a realm is incredibly important as typically being able to rule one grants protection or empowerment under cosmic laws, making it so that not even the Death of The Endless has authority or can intervene in others' domains despite her being usually except from following the rules or how Dream is totally powerless in Hell.

Chronology between the Sphere of The Gods and the normal multiverse are also disconnected. While every realm has its own creation story spanning the beginning of existence up until the present day, their age in the minds of men can be young and have just started burgeoning and spreading across humanity as it only exists because humankind believes it does. This is how Lucifer could exist creating gas giants and stars in the primordial universe or how Blue Flint Girl of the Navajo faith is older than the entire human race despite the Voiceless Ones being the first gods early humanity formed from the collective unconscious. Gods within their own chronology can predate the Big Bang, before the cosmos was born, before time began, within spaces beyond time and distance, in the haze outside of time and space yet at the Beginning, with existences so vast that in certain pantheons the very conception of Reality needed to be sliced apart so that early mortals would not succumb to horror and madness after attempting to make sense of their gods. When the world was newly created and just a speck, a time when the Endless could be considered still “children”, the earliest stories like Cain and Able had already existed.

And while many myths and religions share the key details in origin stories, details differ and provide different meanings and perspectives as to how certain concepts are viewed, as things in reality become metaphor for what happened in myth and not the other way around. There is no single Beginning, but multiple Beginnings, and each Beginning or creation story depends on what you're looking for. Stories live within the living and perceptions of stories and the characters in them will always be clouded through the lens they are seen through. This allows multiple manifestations of the same story to co-exist at once. Divinities are "Temporal Smears" that merge, divide, and ooze into new forms and doctrines to conform to whatever belief they can find. A former Duke of Hell, Balam, states that he has been recontextualized three times in the past, and his present demotion is part of his story. The archetypical "Snake Which Made The World" has taken on the forms of/was simultaneously believed to be multiple mythological beings at once, blurring across time with a thousand faces and meaning. Hostage to the shifting of faith as things don't make sense until they are arranged into a shape.

No story is entirely fantasy, and oldest myths and stories have a major effect on reality when altered, such as when the Fall of Man was undone and all of reality automatically reversed itself back into the Garden of Eden. Everything formed since the Fall whirled back into the Garden and The Source. It is then explained by Eve that the oldest stories like the Garden of Eden, Epic of Gilgamesh, the Lotus of Vishnu, and Coyote and The Old Man are the most foundational and affect the very fabric of reality when they are changed.

Beneath all other mythological realms and afterlives exist the Palimsest, a "subbasement" of reality formed in prehuman times. It is made from the fears of animals, possibly those that evolved into mankind, and has become a refuge for things that did not pass on into the Dreaming. It contains fragments of all other afterlives in a prelinguistic substrate. Animal Gods that appear here like the God of the Krill form and melt away all the time due to the fleeting memory of smaller creatures. The afterlives of infants can be found here as even though their flesh is weak, their imaginations are powerful and their bodies are merely lamp-shades for their minds. For all things mystical and supernatural are made of dream-stuff in the end, as reality is messy and story exists to give it shape. Even though certain events may not have actually happened, they will become true because mortals will remember it as such. Tales and dreams are shadow-truths that will endure after facts have become dust and ash and are forgotten.

Elemental Realms

The Elemental Realms represent the collective consciousnesses of certain things. The Green for instance is the collective consciousness of all plants (or can be defined as such), infinite in size and transcendent of mankind's physics-based and dimensionally bound quantum world, transcending it as part of the imaginal realms as a timeless, conceptual, and metaphysical, lying between nature and reality outside of time and space. It is a psychospiritual web that reaches all the way to Heaven & Hell, through the Timestream, into the Microverse, and the infinite number of afterlives that exist across biospheres. Like the realm itself, the Green's denizens are made of living ideas, memories, and information that affect reality itself. The Norse World Tree, Yggdrasil, is one of its oldest members and a key part of the Norse realms within the Sphere of The Gods.

But the Green is but one of many of the Elemental Realms or Kingdoms. The other most prominent one in DC is the Red. Existing beyond or as the full scope of Animal Man’s Morphogenic Field, which exists behind our reality as a higher platonic reality analogous to the “Implicate Order”, where our reality is unfolded from a higher one having emanated infinitely down in complexity, the Red is the very heart of the lifeweb that connects the consciousnesses of the world of flesh across time and space. Other realms like the Rot have been described as timeless voids, and newer realms like the Industry had its growth described as that of a slumbering idea awakening, echoing across realms and ideas, shifting the foundations of the world.

From the perspective of significant elemental avatars like Swamp Thing, the scales of all space and time can be seen simultaneously. It is notable that The Green spans across multiple realms and can branch out into the white void between worlds, also called the subtle realms, touching all realms and spaces amongst afterlives (more on that later in the In-Between section).

While it does connect to a lot of other realms in the Collective Unconscious, we are capping it here given that the Elemental Realms appear to be far more fragile and affected in comparison to say New Genesis and Apokolips when it comes to attacks on the wider cosmology.

Collective Unconscious

The Collective Unconscious is a metaphysical plane where symbols, archetypes, dreams and ideas are made manifest being not a place but a state of being where mind, matter, thought, and manifestation are all one in the same, allowing one's unconscious mind to create entire universes within the collective unconscious. Every dream, every hope, every fear manifests a possible future, a bubble of possibility. Outsiders vol. 5, a series primarily exploring the Collective Unconscious, referred to the Collective Unconscious as having worlds beyond existence. During the Knight Terrors event where characters could form worlds in their minds, creating even non-euclidean spaces to trap heroes like Nightwing, all such structures within them were described as lacking actual substance and were more illusion than physical reality.

The Collective Unconscious exists past the mind/body barrier and beyond physical reality. It exists beyond space, time, physically, individuality where it vibrates so much deeper that the laws of physics,logic and time are nonexistent, with the “time” and distance that exists within the collective unconscious is the one you create. It exists as the personal realm of Hecate, above the Sphere of The Gods. Hecate was born and shaped herself from the magic at the beginning of creation, the raw burgeoning light of possibility surrounding the multiverse that came before all gods. From there, Hecate's visits with mortals would form new possibilities from the touches of magic she gave them, causing belief to grow and pantheons to form. The very recent Zatanna run by Campbell introduced the idea that while all of the Realms of Magic were made by Hecate, the non-corporeal, ever-shifting nature of them meant that relying on others' conception of it is inferior to following your own map with your very soul as a reference point.

Besides the Sphere of the Gods, there are other spaces in the Collective Unconscious that both reflect and influence the multiverse. For instance, there is a “Dimension Batman” formed from the collective weight of his story and dreams of everyone inspired by his cowl along with anyone with a near-identical narrative (i.e. Bat-Family members) in every universe. The "Collective Bat-Conscious" of the universe's greatest detective. All of space-time hums to form the rule that Batman is based on: "Give the hero something to punch". When The Final Knight attacks the collective unconscious of Batmen, he states that they are all "worms of Barbatos wriggling in the Cosmic Brain" and that the very idea of Batman propagates within The Bleed, and to leave it both Bat-Wing and Batwoman have to cross the Bleed-Barrier and return to their "metaversal frequency".

Black holes are also strangely associated with being conceptual in nature and with the Unconscious, such as when Dream was trapped in one and it was stated to be where no light, information, or dreams can escape to prevent another aspect of Dream from returning. Black holes are vast nothingnesses where not even Dream of The Endless can escape from nor can he reach out for dreams there. Black holes are removed from all worlds and lack emotions, thought, and life. Time is dissolved by black holes and they rend even the Endless themselves. Black holes in other comics like Absolute Martian Manhunter would be established as reaching all the way up to the far shores of human consciousness.

Here we’ll also cover the “higher” and more important realms of the Collective Unconscious that stand apart from the Sphere of The Gods, starting with…

The Snowflake & The Bleed

Yep, it’s this thing again.

The Outsiders vol. 5 reintroduces the concept of the Snowflake from Planetary where Lucius Fox creates a device that would open up not just a map of the multiverse, but something beyond it. And that thing took the form of a cosmic “Snowflake” that exceeds the traditional structures of reality and represents something "well beyond" the infinite multiverse. The Snowflake is the true shape of all reality, containing 196,833 Multiverses with its borders being Limbo.

Individuals like Jakita Wagner and the Final Knight who are immune to changes caused by Crisis Events are able to see the Snowflake be destroyed and the multiverse alter its shape and view it alternatively as a Cosmic Library, containing all realities as stories within it and where the multiverse can be rewritten like a story, described as reaching “Authorship” over reality.

The Snowflake is inherently tied to another concept, the Bleed. While the Snowflake contains every conceivable universe, the Bleed is the wall that separates these realities from one another. It is a metaphysical structure that acts as the capillaries and transdimensional blood that nourishes the multiverse. Within the Bleed, all dimensions are equidistant from one another and the speed at which one traverses it is irrelevant as only skill at navigation matters.

Given the earlier mentioned ties to Destiny of The Endless and positioning the Snowflake also as a Cosmic Library and associated with the Collective Unconscious, it could be implied then that may be representative of the library of the Dreaming or perhaps just how generally reality is viewed from the highest levels of the Collective Unconscious. Regardless, we do know where the Bleed and Snowflake ultimately terminate at. So let’s explore…

Final Heaven

*Disclaimer: Admittedly this one was a fair bit hard to place because its location is never hard confirmed, so we’re placing Final Heaven here out of uncertainty in knowing that it absolutely exists over a good chunk of the cosmology but not outside it.

The Milk Wars event in the Young Animal imprint of DC introduced us to one of the most meta and strange places in DC Cosmology: Final Heaven. It is a space "nearly outside all things" with access to any reality. That in turn gave an organization that operates within it, Retconn, the power to fragment any reality and make composite new realities or "Hyper-Realities". Retconn contains records of everything in fictional mediums such as comic-books or fan fiction. In the perspective of people within Final Heaven, reality is a mere construct and nothing is real. Extra-Dimensional beings on the level of Retconn created an entirely new Robotman from fanfiction.

Its former ruler was Ahl, God of Superheroes. The Master of All Real and Imaginary, a beacon of both Hope and Omnipotence. Ahl is the very schematic of the Superhero archetype. The lineage of Justice descends from him like a tree, expressed as permutations of a mathematical formula and later Ahl descended from Final Heaven down to Earth where the idea of Justice spread from. Justice gave birth to difference and disruption, later all embodied by "three timeless ideals" (i.e. the archetypes of Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman).

The Endless

Born shortly following Perpetua’s Big Bang (and in the previous History of the DC Universe, were born after the Monitor and Anti-Monitor’s clash), the Endless are anthropomorphic personifications of aspects of the universe. They represent repeating patterns, ideas, wave functions, and repeating motifs. Their existences define both what their names represent and their opposite. Death defines Life, Despair defines Hope, Desire defines Hatred, Destiny defines Freedom, Destruction defines Creation, and Dream defines Reality. Delirium’s opposite may be Sanity just through naming convention, however what she fully represents may be larger as she knows of things outside of Destiny's Book and she and the Lords of Chaos share the same style of speech bubble within Gaiman’s Sandman series.

The Endless are conceptual entities that are "ideas cloaked in flesh". Each of their own astral realms are not physical places, but are created by the consciousness of living beings. Mortals can only perceive aspects of The Endless, and the Endless can manifest more than one aspect at a time. When The Endless are typically killed, a different aspect of themselves will just appear with a differing personality. Destiny emerged shortly after the birth of Creation, then Death, Dream, and Destruction followed after him. The first four Endless are older than the angels of Heaven. Desire, Despair, and Delirium only came about when the first sentient beings arose, beings that have existed before humanity. They have been around since before the dawn of time.

The Endless all exist in numerous aspects at once across the universe. Many facets of one being, and the multiplicity of identity for them is merely a function of space thus illusional to the Endless themselves, depicted as each of Dream’s many selves disappearing one by one to each other’s perspective as there is ultimately only one Dream. This is also how “Death” doesn’t just appear as Death of The Endless, but also as death as a void, the Black Racer of the New Gods, and Nekron, the Lord of the Unliving all representing different aspects of death such as one of compassionate release, inevitable ending, and the ultimate opponent.

This is because the Endless are less concerned with the individuals and personalities that are currently the Endless and more focused on the role itself. Per the Titan Cronus, who witnessed Dream’s death and Daniel taking his place, the power and immortality of the Endless reside in the role, not in the being who enacts it. Creation requires the Endless as they are fixed points needed in order for reality to function and that the same applies for entities like the Kindly Ones. Case and point, to stop her lover from capturing Death akin to Dream a woman named Evangeline "became Death" and gained her powers to do so. Essentially by making herself look and act exactly like Death as she remembered her and believing in that, Evangeline became Death. When her lover tries to enact the aforementioned ritual to summon Death, Evangeline states she can feel the sky roll, black holes breaking down, worlds pouring into one another, the line between life & death crumble apart, the light of dead stars, and all the souls within limbo and oblivion. The narration boxes even at the end of the comic also start to change and when previously it was her own thoughts coming through it starts talking back to Evangeline and is heavily implied to be Death.

We’d also see this with Daniel Hall becoming the new Dream of The Endless, transforming into the dream king and taking up Morpheus’ place as part of the family. Daniel does not have the “identity” of Morpheus and it is implied that very identity or his essence had “survived” and begun wandering with his brother Destruction. Despair, who had become the new Despair after the previous died, is treated separately from the original Despair. This in turn is why if a member of the Endless is imprisoned rather than killed, the consequences are more complicated and why you don’t see just another aspect freeing the one that’s trapped. Using an analogy given by Dream himself, the current identity of the Endless is just a facet of the larger "jewel" that is the role or position of the Endless. The Endless’ identities are points of view of the idea/personification of an action that they represent.

And while Destiny seems separate entirely from the rest of the cosmology, even he is majorly influenced and formed by collective thought. One needs to only look at how Destiny’s Book was rewritten twice when the power of Dreams was used to remake creation, explicitly changing Destiny’s book as a result. The destruction of the Dreaming by the Kindly Ones would also cause mirages of Destiny to manifest even in his own Garden. However we will cover more of Destiny himself and his Book in a later section…

Death of The Endless is the "True Death" that comes after all afterlives, having existed before the concept of afterlives came to be and her personal realm is known as Limbo or Oblivion. She and her realm are seemingly timeless, Death already manifesting in her modern look in ancient times, her realm being full of modern items which is how she prefers it. The only souls that don’t go to Death are ones that she herself rejects, who are then picked up by others like the Kindly Ones/The Fates instead. She doesn't care for any kind of cosmic balance, and while Death has multiple manifestations, Death of The Endless as she usually appears is intended to be the "ultimate" Death who will one day claim even the Racer and Nekron. Death brings people to the afterlives or realms they’re meant to go to, including the final destination after every afterlife, “The Light”. From the Black Racer, we know he resides in and is responsible for the Waiturnum, the liminal space between being and unbeing. A boundary world on the fault line of the Source and Great Darkness that acts as a clear path from the multiverse to the Source, bounded on all sides by the Great Darkness. Here Death was made, picked from floating concepts and ideas as the very notion of ending. According to Delirium, who can perceive millions and billions and "squillions" of possibilities at once, all things lead to Death. Death exists in all places and her job will be finished when she claims the last living thing. She will one day claim Destiny and close the door on the universe.

Dream and the Dreaming fundamentally represent all which is not, was not, and shall never be. The Dreaming exists at the edge of the Collective Unconscious and is where all gods are born before going out to establish their own realms. Even inanimate objects or structures like cities dream and form their own realms because of it. From the Dreaming, it is possible to connect all dreams, gods, and stories and erase them all, bringing an end to everything. Things that can manifest at the center of the Dreaming like Dream Vortexes are mortals that manifest as uninvited narratives and break down all its walls and touch all worlds that compose the Dreaming. These dreams all begin to merge into a singular dream as a result and break down the Dreaming's ordered chaos until it collapses in on itself, damaging the Dreaming beyond repair. This once occurred aeons ago and destroyed a previous iteration of the world when Dream allowed the vortex to reach a point he could no longer undo or repair. The Dreaming is composed of tales & nightmares, woven on the loom of sleeping minds. The Dreaming is infinite, but paradoxically bounded on all sides. All the tales in this realm are written in notion and intention. The Dreaming is Dream himself, and all things in it are portions of himself (likely applicable to all Endless as well). Everyone in the Dreaming dreams the Dreaming, and all dreamers are its draftsmen.

It is in the nature of Dream to define reality, and the more people share in a belief or a dream the more it comes into reality, the chief example of this being when a thousand humans dreamed in unison that they were the dominant species and reality and history so that humanity was always the dominant species over cats (and reversing it through dreams could hypothetically be done with enough cats). A similar event would occur when Dream channeled the dreams of a thousand dreamers (& with aid from his father’s Saeculum) to remake creation and undo all the damage it suffered as a result of a mad star that Dream did not kill eons ago, rewriting Destiny’s book itself. Though worth noting this completely drains Dream of all his power and requires rest in his own realm to recover. Conversely, anything Dream does is felt by or reflected in reality. When Dream makes love, all things feel and dream it. The Dreaming also somehow contains dreams that no one has dreamt, yet are somehow older than the oldest stories like Eve.

Destruction is the middle-child of the Endless. Due to having abandoned his duties, he has the least amount of exposition around himself or his functions among the Endless, but thanks to him we know that even though he isn't active as Destruction, his function still allows for things to be created or destroyed. Destruction is the force of change, with the only difference being that no one is running it anymore. By taking his sigil with him, Destruction ensured no one could take his place. His realm is called The Fulcrum, with he and his realm embodying the moment between an ending and a beginning.

Desire is the force that keeps bacteria and galaxy together. She is lust and wanting and all the things that drive them. Her realm is thought to be the reverse of the Dreaming, where the Dreaming is filled with practically an infinite number of stories and is greatly varied in its landscape and inhabitants, Desire's Twilight Realm is empty save for one thing: The Threshold, a fortress made in the image of Desire containing endless hallways.

Despair of The Endless exists beyond hope. Without her, nothing exists, and there is nothing that can be abolished without her without violating physical practicalities or human nature, i.e. "The Law of Conservation of Happiness". Her existence defines joy, love, and triumph. She is the very presence that makes present absence unbearable. In one of the major ways the Endless have significantly shaped the DC multiverse, it is none other than Despair of The Endless who conceived of the very concept of Superman, pitching it to Krypton's star/its chief god Rao.

Delirium, the youngest of the Endless, is still older than all gods and every sun in existence. Delirium knows things that none of the Endless know, even Destiny himself as she knows of paths outside his book. Her realm is a chaotic one with a sundial with “Tempus Frangit” (Time Breaks) etched onto it. While famously she used to be Delight of The Endless before she mysteriously transformed into Delirium, she can still briefly manifest as Delight, albeit it is painful for her to do so.

At the very Foundation of things do we know that the different realms of The Endless all connect, which we see through Death and Dream’s realms being connected at the Foundation, representing parts of their realms where neither can exclude the other. This Foundational layer has been described as a nothingness blacker than the butthole of the universe and yet Desire of The Endless can harmlessly exist in and influence others in this realm even though it sucks from you everything that makes you what you are, existing as an empty void of pure nothing.

But as omnipresent The Endless all seem, even they aren’t all-powerful or all-pervasive. A number of entities, chiefly their own parents (who we’ll talk about later), appear to be totally beyond their scope and unknowable even to them. The “A.I. dream” known as WAN as being asked to be the new Dream King in place of the missing Dream, stated that he could have ascended to realities higher than the Dreaming but only stayed out of empathy to its inhabitants. And lastly, Dream himself has stated that all of The Endless are ultimately servants of mortals, not the other way around. All the Endless only exist because people believe they exist, and when the last living thing has died then their function is complete, mortals manipulating them until the end akin to toys or dolls. Fundamentally they are still of the Collective Unconscious.

Lords of Order & Chaos

The Lords of Order and Chaos are two primordial forces of the universe, maintaining the balance of reality. The Lords of Order & Chaos have been fighting since the beginning of time, both born at the very moment of Creation, with the universe bending to their cycles of supremacy. Order serves The Light while Chaos serves The Darkness and the final cycle will end in the Golden Age where Order will rule. This is the Yuga Cycle.

The Garden of Order has existed before Heaven, Hell, and before the first god shed her inaugural cradle tear. Animals, objects, and creatures here exist as metaphors such as the Concordance Stone that knows all things that will ever come to pass or Order's gardener, who is a child of Fate. Birds here embody poetry and their death would remove that concept from countless universes, and the same goes with Cats embodying doubt while Bees are equated with Great Ones. The whole realm itself is a balance of order between all the species within it.

Creation is bordered by the four great seas of Chaos from which it sprang from and will return to at the end of time. It lurks at the edges of existence and its seas lap at existence's shores, slowly eating away at all reality. Chaos is eternal, more real than even The Endless as even they will die too as Order becomes Disorder. It will outlast everything and win in the end as Entropy.

When Harley Quinn once “accidentally” destroyed continuity in an event considered to be more disastrous than the Milk Wars in Final Heaven, it would later be revealed that this and Harley’s other adventures with the Continuity Corps (in issues #51, 52, and 62 of Harley Quinn vol. 3, which we can’t link because fuck you imgur I’m tired of your shit - Cardinal) were all part of a larger trial by the Lords of Order and Chaos and they themselves had the power to alter continuity and see reality as if it were comics akin to Harley in this run, if not outright superior as their powers could overcome fate and Death directly claiming Harley’s mother when Harley’s own meta powers couldn’t.

The Lords of Order and Chaos are deeply tied to the Shining Tower, a construct within each universe considered to be the metaphysical wellspring and pillar of creation that exists at the center of the very notion of existence. It’s the axis around which the endless cycle of birth, death, rebirth, and suffering turns upon. The Shining Tower maintains the balance between Order and Chaos and if it were to stop turning then everything in existence would be destroyed. Without the tower, all of High Space would break down and cease the cycle of existence. Concepts would cease to exist entirely, even the concept of a concept if the tower were destroyed. It also maintains the karmic cycle of souls, the monadic cores in all living things, permanently erasing all life.

The balance between Order and Chaos as shown with the Shining Tower maintains birth, decay, death, and rebirth as a cycle. It is responsible for endless life stretching infinitely across the past and future. The imbalance of Order and Chaos and the destruction of the Shining Tower would ripple backwards and forwards in time and weaken the "superstructure" of space-time until creation implodes in on itself. Creation is akin to playing hundreds of thousands of songs at the same time, producing endless variation and that when the song is over, another is played again repeating forever and ever. Order and Chaos are then defined by matching the signature and rhythm of all these songs playing, forming the endless loop that creates and contains space-time and if they stop then everything shatters. This is the universal drama that has been playing out for a literal infinite amount of time.

The City of Cannon, one of the domains of the Lords of Order on Earth, is formed from one of the most important concepts to the narrative: Guns. The Cannon is the First & Last Gun, born from the fabric of the universe and built by Destiny of The Endless. It has the power to burn away at the superstructure that is the Snowflake / multiversal library, and when the Lords of Order fire it the entire cycle will reset back to the First Age of the Yuga Cycle. The Cannon will destroy continuity, but keeping the cycle from ending will cause infinite variation and cause the story to be unbound. Existence is the single story and pattern of rebirth and death until the end of time, but the Cannon executes worlds and obliterates choice. With the right ammunition, it will burn all books of the Cosmic Library, shattering the Snowflake forever.

Heaven & Hell

Formed shortly after the Big Bang, Heaven and Hell are two of the oldest and most important realms in the DC multiverse, both realms existing as reflections of one another and defining one another as well. Without Hell, Heaven would lose its meaning.

Heaven is a higher order of reality compared to the universe, and if angels were to enter the universe in their full glory they would devastate it. Heaven is "not a place" its a state of consciousness with the angles being "everywhere” with there being many “heavens beyond counting" Taylor made for the souls that arrive there to the beliefs each of them held on earth with Some of these move beyond the limits of these more conventional afterlifes leaving behind the illusion of flesh and individual identity behind,living an existence of formless free floating bliss. With the stranger implying there is even more beyond those, like the fourth heaven which is beyond place and day. Heaven does not bother with time as it doesn't exist there. Any moment is every moment for these realms.

Angels like cherubs are platonic beings, and the War in Heaven was fought with beasts composed of allegory. And the War in Heaven wasn’t just the first war, but the war that all others are shades and reflections of. Distance and time are considered illusions to angels, granting them the power to fly across worlds and later unnamed fodder angels can fly across the Void. Heaven and its Silver City exist so far up high up amongst afterlives that angels have to fly downwards into the void between worlds to reach the Dreaming.

When Paula Holt of Earth-23 returns from her supposed death as an angel, she describes Heaven as a place outside of time where the heat death of the universe cannot reach it, whose entrance exists at the very beginning of time. The Angels manifested as possibilities without bounds, and the wings they granted Paula gave her the ability to fly across all history and her sword cleaves time itself. From Paula's new angelic perspective, she can treat time as if it were an object, or specifically a comic book where she can rip apart comic panels and fly in the blank comic page and speak directly to the reader.

Hell is “a place that isn’t a place”, stated to be more vast and open compared to and existing beneath other underworlds or afterlives. Hell also has manifested in multiple aspects based around the mind of the individual. Its sheer size baffles even Dream of The Endless, despite his own realm being infinite. There are so many souls in Hell that despite Death being able to claim numerous lives across Creation as it was coming to an end, all souls being freed from Hell by Lucifer caused Death of The Endless to be strapped for time doing her job.

Time collapses in these afterlifes with the death and destruction Hal would cause as Parallax manifested there the moment Abin Sur gave Hal the ring. Souls can form both their own Heaven and their own Hell with them simultaneously on multiple different planes of reality with all souls being anchored in Heaven and tied to the creator even those condemned to Hell.

Beyond both Heaven and Hell, at the metaphorical edge of the coin that Heaven & Hell represent, is the Mansions of Silence. The Mansions contain all the rejected iterations of Creation. People who pass through them experience the alternate lives they would have lived and anything that exists the shards within the Mansions of Silence take the place of their counterpart within Creation. This place gives form and substance to spirit and is where angels pass through after they die. And past even that is The Pavilion of The Lanterns, part of the path taken by gods on their way to non-existence. Neither Death nor causality exist here, and Tsukuyomi, its gardener, is certain that even Eikon Presto, the son of the Basanos, would be unable to challenge him in the Pavilion implying this place is beyond the reach of the Endless.

The In-Between

Also known as the Space Between, the In-Between is the space between metaphysical realms that separate even the realms of The Endless. It is an empty space of nothingness where no time exists. When worlds disappear only the white void of the In-Between is left. It separates life and death, existing everywhere and nowhere. A realm of nothing that technically doesn't exist where only spirit and consciousness can pass through as otherwise physically entering it, even with tools meant to cross the multiverse, cannot escape barring special beings like The Fates, The Endless, or their emissaries as shown in previous scans. It is an abstract realm, existing between what is and what is not, containing things that exist in contradiction but are all still true. It does act as an afterlife of sorts, associated with the Bagua and its eight trigrams that represent Yin & Yang.

The Spectre, who could access this space, referred to it as the Strangeways. Still remaining consistent as a void between dimensions, it would also be called a crossroads between the mystic and mundane. A place where the worlds of living and unliving intersect. The In-Between has existed before Light, Dark, the World, Heaven, or Magic, where primordial entities like Cain were born before the rest of existence. Archetypical stories like the Snake in the Garden of Eden were born from primordial entities like Cain. It's the gap between and beyond all places. The in-between is where the “World of Forms” empties out into the great void caught between everything and nothing.

Comic Book Limbo

When vibrations have ceased and you’ve officially run out of multiverse, one enters Limbo. This realm is one of no stories where forgotten characters end up, coming from their stories being cancelled or through tears from Crisis events. It is the last outpost of existence where nothing happens without intervention from outside.

Monitor Sphere

Formed as part of the “current universal structure” following the collapse of the infinite Pre-Crisis worlds and formation of the newly made 52 Earths, the Monitor Sphere exists at the edge of things. Mar Novu, the original Monitor, would be splintered and reborn into 52 aspects of himself that would call the Monitor Sphere home: The Monitors.

The Monitors transcend the Collective Unconscious, given that the Monitor Sphere is described as a higher dimension beyond Limbo and sees it as a small flat disk. It is a form of void and the realm has 5,555 names that all mean "Nothing". Inhabitants of Nil are made of pure thought and exist as primal forms in a fundamental world, formerly featureless until time leaked into their realm. Like the realms before it, it is archetypical in nature and exists at the edge of creation.

Dark Multiverse

But from the highest points of the multiverse we delve down to the lowest: The Dark Multiverse. Among the three building blocks of creation, dark matter far outnumbers matter and antimatter; a fact reflected with the Dark Multiverse being so large it is compared to an ocean that the DC multiverse floats on top of. It is a realm of an infinite number of nightmare worlds.

It has its own, dark version of the Sphere of The Gods and Collective Unconscious ruled by the Upside-Down Man, Hecate’s dark parallel when she saw her own reflection back at her in the dark. At the very depths of the Dark Multiverse is the World Forge, where all universes are made from and tossed into either the positive or dark matter multiverses by the World Forger, brother to the Monitor and Anti-Monitor making this realm likely comparable to the Monitor Sphere. The Dark Multiverse is so massive that after Mandrakk, the Dark Monitor, fell from the Monitor Sphere it was revealed that he didn’t fall into the Overvoid but rather the Dark Multiverse, needing to crawl out of it and back up into the Monitor Sphere which speaks to the Dark Multiverse’s sheer scope given how large Monitors are. It also possesses a connection to a section of the Dreaming’s library, as ultimately the Dark Multiverse is a realm of the stories that shouldn’t exist.

Individual worlds in the Dark Multiverse have been shown to contain replicas of the entire multiverse such as a world where Barbatos was victorious in Dark Nights Metal showing the Orrery of Worlds existing within it, another that showed the aftermath of COIE and spaces outside reality, and another world containing the infinite number of Pre-Crisis Earths.

Divine Continuum

The Divine Continuum refers to what is the totality of existence and its two key parts: space & time, expressed as the Omniverse & Hypertime, also distinguished in nature as the former being conceptual while the latter is emotional. It encompasses all previous realms and spaces stated previously. The intersection point between the two parts of the Divine Continuum is known as the Branefold Interior, the physical manifestation of Hypertime abstraction, home of the Fuginauts who are the successors to the Monitors.

The Omniverse

The full scale of the Omniverse isn’t actually seen for most of DC History. Or at least, not until it was destroyed during Crisis on Infinite Earths. Both the Dark Crisis on Infinite Earths & the New History of the DC Universe establish that the infinite multiverses of Infinite Frontier were “false” as the true Omniverse would be restored only after the Pre-Crisis multiverse was restored. When Dr. Multiverse & Flash restore the Pre-Crisis Earths, we see the entire Multiversity map dwarfed by the return of all the Earths, all occupying the same space now and every restored world being comparable in size to the multiverse as represented on the Multiversity Map. This is the full scale of the Omniverse, which we can already kind of see when it comes to the scale of the Dark Multiverse where individual Earths within it contained more than one reality and Crisis events and alternate versions of entities like Barbatos.

Hypertime

Originally introduced in The Kingdom, a sequel story to Kingdom Come, Hypertime was initially established as a means of exploring alternate realities while keeping to the then Post-Crisis status quo of there being only one universe. In its very first appearance Hypertime was stated to be a vast, interconnected web of parallel timelines composing all reality. Hypertime is infinite, an unpredictable multiverse with an infinite number of parallel worlds. For every moment in the space-time continuum, an infinite number of parallel realities branch off based on an infinite number of decisions. It is a web of Timestreams outside the multiverse, and hyper-moments within it exist outside of time. In the aftermath of Infinite Crisis, the sprouting new fifty-one Earths that would form the Orrery were described as generating new branches within Hypertime. This is how there could both be “just” 52 Earths between Infinite Crisis and the restored infinite worlds in Dark Crisis, they all exist within Hypertime.

Another perspective would be to look at it through the lens of geometry. While he didn’t create the concept, Grant Morrison’s contributions to it are undeniably the most significant and his explanation for how time works in DC would serve as the basis for many future depictions of it and additions to the concept. A timeline, or “line space” is exactly that, a singular line representative of an entire history from its start to end. Individual moments within it are “points” on that line such as the Vanishing Point, the terminus or end point of a timeline. But there’s more than one timeline right? That’s the Plane Time: all timelines co-existing on the same plane converging and separating as an immense cosmic loom where each track represents a different universe, a separate vibration or superstring. And from there even higher perspectives of time such as Cube Time exist where Plane Time is infinitely flat by comparison, and Hypercube Time (i.e. Hypertime) exists even higher than that.

Grant Morrison would then provide another analogy for the “geometry of time” in his substack:

“The 2-D timeplane was what all of your comics looked like spread out on a massive floor. Where 1938 Superman could exist at the same time on the same floor as 2022 Superman.

The time plane naturally implied a time cube of stacked realities, piled timeplanes extending perpendicularly into our own dimensionality (both the aliens in 52 and Bat-Mite in Batman call this cube Space B, implying that Space A is the Timeplane).

From there you can do hypercube time and so on, in each case imagining a more panoramic and elaborate picture which not only includes we, the readers, but also potentially higher dimensional forms of life or intelligence existing ‘above’ our own.

This was the schematic I drew on a hotel notepad and showed to Mark Waid the next day. It was Waid who suggested calling the idea ‘Hypertime’.”

Starting from the smallest unit of time, we have a “point” or singular moments in time such as the Vanishing Point, which exists either outside or within the fringes of the Time Stream as a sub-section of Hypertime, consistently accessed through travel via the Time Stream given that there are other outposts in the Time Stream close to the Vanishing Point at the end of time, where due to existing at the end of time no history can be made there. Spurrier’s Flash run even implies the existence of multiple Vanishing Points as there are multiple, different versions of the Linear Men/Bureau with their own outposts. Worth pointing out however it is still made of time itself and time from the Time Stream still flows into the Vanishing Point, just differently via Time Rapids.

Cube Time / Space B would later be depicted as existing across worlds connected through interlocking and overlapping patterns and the space between them and is the home of malformed ideas beyond the limits of human imagination. The 52 series following Infinite Crisis would also establish the white space where Animal Man manipulates the comic medium along with the aliens that granted him his powers as Space B, also called The Continuum. Cube Time / Space B / The Continuum is described as allowing one access to any space or time, the space behind reality from which continuous creation and destruction occurs. It contains records of the history of the multiverse, containing holdovers from previous continuities including past Crisis events. It's also where Animal Man goes to in that famous panel where he sees the reader and gets the power to manipulate the comic-book medium.

Psycho Pirate’s powers, associated with Cube Space in the same Animal Man run, would be described as him being unstuck from the universe, seeing beyond reality itself. He perceives "the Pale Gutters" behind reality, pulling apart the comic panels to reveal "the flimsy white fabric each universe is built on" that exists unmoored from Crisis events and the rebuilding of the multiverse afterwards, existing outside it all. However, New Gods like Darkseid and concepts like the Anti-Life Equation exist beyond the Pale Gutters, suggesting the Sphere of The Gods transcends Cube Space.

John Stewart: Emerald Knight would add to this, explaining that every universe is akin to a river flowing off from the Source. When a river/universe splits, that creates a multiverse. However smaller diversions or streams in the river that return back to it without making a new universe is what makes up Hypertime. Old Gods and New Gods and similar entities like Ascended can manipulate Hypertime and create Hypertime branches, consistent with Darkseid transcending the Pale Gutters / Cube Space.

During Final Crisis, the typically timeless realm of the Monitor Sphere became “infected” with time and this in turn gave the Monitors identity, emotion, and narrative which, while probably not having this exactly in mind, lines up with how Hypertime is described as emotional in nature. This also all lines up with what we mentioned before that the Fuginauts, who live within and across the Omniverse & Hypertime, succeeded the Monitors and were capable of traveling to the Monitor Sphere, placing Hypertime’s farthest reaches to this layer of DC Cosmology.

Destiny’s Book

Destiny's Book contains everything that has happened, is happening, and will happen. There is nothing that isn't written in the book, because the book is the universe itself and only Destiny is allowed to see the stories the universe shapes for itself. Destiny is unsure if the book being chained to him is so that the two are never separated or because they are one and the same. Carrying the book means carrying the universe itself, and Destiny finds himself in his book from time to time as he is still an inhabitant of the universe. Hence why we are somewhat tiering this separate from Destiny himself given it’s in the Book’s nature to contain even Destiny, as well as the fact that his book was given to him by an even more powerful being: his dad. More on him later.

Destiny sees the end in every beginning, hears the last word echo in the first. There are things Destiny cannot see, however usually he knows when he is going to be surprised. All things walk in Destiny's shadow, and the path to his garden requires traversing the byways of the past and forgotten years, but all roads lead to Destiny's Garden eventually. Powerful, mystic beings like The Horseman of Pestilence are powerless to change the contents of Destiny's Book or try to cheat him even with pages torn from the book.

Destiny's Garden is a maze that divides, branches, and recombines. His book, the very universe itself, contains every detail of your life, everything that will happen to you, and everything you've forgotten. Everything that has happened or will happen, all secrets of the universe from the beginning to the end of time are written there. All mathematical laws and laws of physics are within Destiny's Book. All that comes after when he lays the book down is unwritten. The Garden's "geography" is distinct from time and space, instead it is where the potential becomes actual. All things have their genesis in Destiny's Garden, despite the fact that his Garden is beyond beginnings and endings. His realm is fate itself, though it's notable that the Kindly Ones can read farther ahead into the future than Destiny can to where he has to turn pages ahead in his book and determine what they mean. Where his brother Dream is prince of metaphor and allegory, Destiny has dominion over all that is, of actions, consequences, and paths.

Another, more direct example would be how the angel Meleos once made a copy of Destiny’s Book in the form of a set of cards, the Basanos. He made them entirely off every word and thought humankind has ever had, and the power of the Basanos was akin to holding a remote that controls the entire world, being able to see the past and all branches of the future at once. The drawings that form the Basanos on the cards “sublime all undrawn lines and potential figures into perfect stasis” and the cards themselves are referred to as the bastard children of Destiny and Chance. The Basanos contain the road maps of unlived time. "The Maybe Worlds" show all the possibilities that could have been, and in the war to defend Creation the Basanos' child, Noema, could see numerous possibilities where Creation was saved or destroyed.

The Fourth Dimension

So with Hypertime existing as high as it does, that certainly means we’re done talking about time right? Well… not exactly. For instance we get implications of this when following the destruction of Hypertime during the events of Death Metal, an Anti-Crisis amped Wonder Woman and the Darkest Knight were still able to punch each other backwards and forwards linearly through time. So how does that work exactly?

Well as we come to find out later in Spurrier’s Flash run (Flash vol. 6), we find out that Time as a whole is the very "Dream" of the Deep Change, an aspect of the Source outside the Source Wall. DC’s multiverse is one of emanation, echoing downwards in complexity from the Deep Change. And similar to that all of the “Forces” like Speed, Still, Sage, or Strength Forces are all merely expressions of a universal constant: Time. An attack on the Great Dream of the Deep Change means Time itself is being attacked, an act that affects the entire cosmology such as causing the Elemental Realms to shudder and evaporate, affect linchpins of reality like the New Gods, and reach all the way up to the Source Wall. The aspect of Time being attacked in this storyline is specified to be the Fourth Dimension, and the Linear Bureau's operations within the Fourth Dimension reach to even an observation point for the Deep Change consistent with Time spanning all the way up to the Source Wall. Furthermore, we know the Fourth Dimension doesn’t refer to just a single timeline in this storyline as the Bureau are later depicted in the same run as monitoring every timeline in the multiverse up until the end of time, as well as Eclipso’s growth after he merged with the child of the Deep Change, so it can’t just be the Time Stream.

But wait, isn’t the Fifth and Sixth Dimensions supposed to transcend the Fourth Dimension? If the Source Wall is supposed to be the limit to the entire multiverse, how can the Fourth Dimension reach it and yet another two layers of the cosmology continue to exist? Well for that we need to take a look at the latest Batman / Superman: World’s Finest run for an explanation: Where the first three dimensions deal with shape and geometry, the Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth all deal with Time in some respect. The Fourth is Time itself, the Fifth is Time creating infinite possibility (Imagination), and the Sixth is where all Time exists at once. So the three temporal dimensions in Snyder’s run aren’t really layered realms, but how time exists in different states and transforms itself.

This is most clear in the latest (at the time of writing) DC event: DC K.O. where the very center of the plot revolves around the Heart of Apokolips: a Fourth Dimensional construct unbound by physics that generates the highest concentration of Omega Energy in the universe. So much so that Darkseid’s growth as the King Omega of reality surpasses the temporal powers of the Quantum Quorum, which included the World Forger and Time Trapper Doomsday, letting him come out victorious over and consume every variation of history and would eventually become the sole celestial entity in the multiverse. During the K.O. Tournament, the Heart demonstrated the power to forcibly summon Imps like Mr. Mxyzptlk into the tournament and then petrify him as with all other casualties of the tournament. King Omega Superman, one with the Heart of Apokolips, could even travel back to the very beginning of Time, the very moment of the Big Bang that contains all possibility and everything in the multiverse where past, present, and future exist at once, and absorb it to match Darkseid, who had become one with all other points in time. And even before all this Time Trapper Doomsday was able to travel back in time to events involving Sixth Dimensional entities like the Doom-Mite. So between entities and constructs from the Fourth Dimension being relative to entities from both Fifth and Sixth Dimensions, the Heart’s feat of absorbing Sixth Dimensional constructs like the Big Bang that formed the entire multiverse (also associated directly with Perpetua's hand at the moment of creation in Death Metal), the Fourth Dimension should exist on the same plane and be tiered the same as the Fifth & Sixth Dimensions as all three are just different forms of Time. A concept of Time that’s clearly higher than every other conception of it in the DC multiverse such as Hypertime.

The Time Trapper is frequently associated with the Fourth Dimension, their connection to it having allowed the first Time Trapper to side step and remain unaffected by cosmic spanning events like Crisis on Infinite Earths, existing outside dimensionality. Harley Quinn’s meta powers and Booster Gold’s level of time travel were equated with traveling across continuity, allowing them to revisit past Crisis Events or “Crossover Events” as if traveling back through pages in a story, and Harley herself due to her meta powers at the time was called a Fourth Dimensional being. Harley’s Fourth Dimensional perspective made her "too high level" and unaffected by the events in the Collective Unconscious like Knight Terrors.

The Fourth Dimension has its own equivalent to Imps being “Demons” such as when Jon Kent went up against such an entity: “Master Txyz”. His mere arrival from the future into the past terrified Mr. Mxyzptlk despite the fact that he should have an additional dimension over Txyz. To explain that, Mxyzptlk makes the analogy that the relationship between Fifth Dimensional Imps and Fourth Dimensional Demons are akin to humans (Imps) being more evolved than bears or cavemen (Demons), but of course a human would still be terrified of a bear. All this implying that there isn’t a quantitative or even qualitative leap between Fourth & Fifth Dimensions.

Txyz's Fourth Dimensional nature gives him the power to manipulate all of time and space, everything that ever is or was, even to the point of being able to casually travel and perceive the events of DC K.O. and the final battle between Superman and Darkseid despite that conflict happening across all of time, even back to the very Big Bang that created the multiverse.

The Speed Force (& other Forces)

As mentioned before, the Speed Force and all other such Forces are emanations of Time and the Deep Change. In Darkseid’s attempt to spread all across Time he referenced replacing the Speed Force as integral to accomplishing this, for the Speed Force is the "nervous system of all that ever was, is, and shall be" that can make even the Heart of Apokolips bleed. There are even hints to this as far back as the Multiversity Map showing that the Speed Force is lightning coming down from Overvoid to generate the Speed Force Wall. The Speed Force exists beyond Hypertime, detaching itself from it and even being capable of destroying and replacing it. The Speed Force, along with Dr. Light channeling the Light of Creation, could restore the entirety of the Pre-Crisis multiverse of infinite worlds.

The Fifth Dimension

The realm of Imagination and infinite possibility, the Fifth Dimension is the very lifeblood of the multiverse existing outside of time. It's a nonsense world where raw imagination is equated with illogicality and unreason, existing beyond the logical lands. Its inhabitants are Hyper-Life that exist completely outside the material world and even Heaven, the Imps. The Fifth Dimension is older than the Dreaming and exists higher than it, acting as the very source of the "time" that passes through it while otherwise irritated when forced to manifest in it. They see through the limits of time and space and cannot comprehend the linearity of the Fourth Dimension.

Imps move freely across time & Hypertime, and exist even beyond it, shown more clearly when Nix Uotan attempted to fight and then escape the Imps of the Gentry; they remained totally out of his reach despite him being capable of reaching the edges of space and time as a Monitor. Or how denizens of the Godsphere can perceive Hypertime but cannot perceive the Fifth Dimension at all. Even the Dreaming is seen as nothing but a comic to the likes of Mxyzptlk. Scott Snyder’s Justice League run would later establish that Imps exist outside of time and spans the Multiversity map in its entirety (scan shown below in the Sixth Dimension section).

And while the Sixth Dimension is touted as the highest realm of them all, Imps from the Fifth Dimension like Bat-Mite can breach into the Sixth Dimension and later rip the Sixth Dimension out of an Imp with help from other Imps and Magicians, suggesting there isn’t a qualitative difference between the two.

The Sixth Dimension

“The Observation Room” of the multiverse from which all of time exists at once, the Sixth Dimension is the highest (for now) realm of the DC Multiverse, with only the Greater Omniverse lying beyond it. It’s in this space that Sixth Dimensional beings like Perpetua and her children can hold the multiverse in hand.

From the Sixth Dimension, the World Forger crafted Hypertime and could later recreate it along with the entire multiverse again from within the Sixth Dimension. It’s also observed that Hypertime could be destroyed there and have its function replaced entirely by the Speed Force without the Sixth Dimension being affected whatsoever. And later again as Perpetua and the Darkest Knight were damaging the multiverse in their battle, it's stated that Hypertime and its possibilities had burnt out. The battle between the two, who are described as "Omega Class Entities" by the Chronicler from the Greater Omniverse, their fight raged across every facet of reality and could collapse the entire system of the multiverse. All of this too of course suggests that the Sixth Dimension is beyond all other layers within the multiverse and surpasses other temporal concepts like Hypertime.

It’s noted by the Chronicler that most Creations succumb to Entropy, however certain powers in the DC multiverse like The Basanos, a copy of Destiny’s Book, can undo Entropy entirely. If reality were a lantern show, The Basanos would be the lenses by which all infinite possibilities of shape and color are focused, only limited by laws established in The Presence's Creation.

According to Lucifer, who had observed The Presence’s creation of reality, Time is the most important factor when you're making a new Cosmos.

Father Time & Mother Night

The ultimate personifications of the essential concepts that form Creation: Father Time and Mother Night, the parents of the Endless. In the beginning, the union of Night, who lacked boundaries, and Time, the beat in which things could become, formed the universe and all possible versions of it. 

Father Time's realm exists in loops and whirls as he wishes, causality is reversed or disconnected entirely. Destiny's Book was given to him by Father Time as his birthright. Father Time gave existence to The Endless and the moments in which they are allowed to exist, and all things are his or will be his in him. He owns everything and granted Destiny his book. Time exists above continuity changes and apparently the Endless, as he has no issues interacting with both Dream in the present and Daniel Hall Dream in the future at the same time despite the story of Sandman: Overture ending in Dream altering reality to where Destiny’s Book changed. The power of artifacts of his like the Saeculum allowed Desire of The Endless to bring in a ship into Destiny's Garden without it being written in his book and reset time repeatedly to save Dream and all Creation from being destroyed.

Mother Night exists beneath all Creation, with it having once all belonged to her. She and her realm exist in untime and unspace, beyond the event horizon of any black hole including the kind that can trap and cut-off even the Endless themselves. All her children are considered to be just echoes of her. The reunion of this couple could restore all Creation and remove all bad dreams away, and much later the present version of Dream, Daniel Hall, asked exactly this of them: a boon from both Darkness and Time so that he could hatch an entirely new Kosmos separate from the old one, disconnecting Dream from the mantle of Dream of The Endless and the poison that was killing him.

The Gallery of Moments

When Wally West received a sudden boost to his powers and connection to the Speed Force during Spurrier’s Flash run, Wally West suddenly began being able to access entirely new planes of existence he couldn’t perceive before. They were “Impossible Planes” that allowed Wally to, quote, "...Stepping out. Out of everything. Physics and distance and vibration. Out of time. Out of the thread of my own story." And after venturing deeper, he makes his way to the Gallery of Moments. This place is the "lowest vibration of all" "a place beyond time. A place where thought and expression are one..." and allowing Wally to interact with the speech bubbles in the comic.

The Gallery is deeper than time & space, where only concept exists. Measurement, memory, and movement have no place here and are all untrustworthy. Reality at its slowest vibration is the abstraction of the mind. a place described as beyond distance & direction. But if there is a lowest vibration, then there must also be a highest vibration. And that leads us to…

The Source Wall

The Source Wall, the highest vibration before reaching the Infinite at the edge of the world. While individual universes may have their own Source Walls bordering their edges, the full Source Wall exists at the very edge of the Promethean Galaxy, the farthest finite border to reality itself within the Sixth Dimension. Here is the very limit to thought itself, having taken the place of the Anti-Matter Universe as the border of Creation, separating the multiverse from the Overvoid. It stretches beyond the infinite as the soul of all planes of existence. It is the ultimate power and barrier, a tribute to all that lies beyond the imagination of man and the reality of his accomplishments, built by the Cosmic Raptor to contain Perpetua herself. So fundamental it is that damage to the Source Wall can fracture the Fifth Dimension and erase New Gods from existence.

From the Source Wall also exists an Aleph, a spot in existence where one can view the entirety of Creation all at once. When Metron and Swamp Thing went there, they mistakenly believed they had entered the Source. From the Aleph they could see that at the most basic level, life exists as vibrational patterns. One can see all the great galactic structures down to the lowest swarms of microbes, perceiving them all from every angle. All of space and time could be perceived, the multitude of universes collapsing on each other attempting unification for a coherent cosmology as the great wheel of creation is thrown out of balance. One experiences the experiences of all life from all time at once.

Cosmology Cutoff

From here on out, none of this cosmology applies to Trigon so feel free to read it for fun or to learn more about what else lies beyond the Source Wall in DC Comics.

Full Creation

*Disclaimer: This section isn’t representative of an extra layer for creation, just things somewhat outside the typical structure of DC that certainly is important and has been used in more than one and/or very big storylines but don’t fit neatly in being placed along with the other upper echelon dimensions in DC.

Elaine Belloc’s Creation

During the hectic final arcs of Lucifer, Elaine Belloc, now empowered with her father’s Dunamis Demiurgos, made her own Creation, standing on its own and separate from Lucifer's or The Presence's. By the end of Lucifer vol. 1, both The Presence's and Lucifer's Creations would be dropped into Elaine's, making her the God of this new singular Creation. Not only would she embody and command this new, larger Creation, but Elaine would restructure the entire Afterlife itself, changing the shapes and patterns from what they used to be before. She would reform Hell into a series of nested realms and it is she who holds all of existence together.

But Lucifer & The Presence’s Creations didn’t suddenly fuse as one. Instead it’s shown later in Holly Black’s Lucifer run that Lucifer and The Presence's Creations are separated by a border and the evil "Dark" Presence in the storyline could not reach into Lucifer's because of the divide while it's implied that Elaine could as both are part of her world. And mind you that Lucifer’s Cosmos isn’t just a single universe or a realm like Hell. Lucifer’s Cosmos is a Totality. A multiverse in and of itself.

Perpetua’s Creation (& other previous Creations)

The DC Multiverse we all read and love was not the first one. And no we’re not talking about versions between Crisis events, but rather whole iterations of Creation from top to bottom. We know that one earlier such example was the Creation that belonged to the Jin En Mok, who supposedly come from the very “First” Cosmos and have been surviving the destruction of subsequent Creations by surviving in the Void before re-entering the next one. From there, we know the multiverse right before the current one was made by Perpetua, a Sixth Dimensional Hand of the Presence, who rent a portion of the Overvoid to make the current multiverse and dividing it into three states of matter, Positive Matter, Dark Matter, and Anti-Matter. This iteration of the multiverse already had much of the same structures as the current one such as the Sphere of The Gods, a multiverse populated with Earths, and the World Forge and its discarded worlds that would form the Dark Multiverse.

Following the discovery of Perpetua’s betrayal of her purpose and consequently being sealed in the Source Wall as punishment, the multiverse would be remade into the one we see today! And in the timeless perspective of the Void, an infinite number of Creations have come before and will come after the current one, their rises and falls forming the "heartbeat" of the Void.

The Multiverse Dial

So as mentioned way back, the first of the proper metaphysical realms is the Heroverse, a structure containing the metaphysical potential of all living beings. But this Heroverse only plays one part of a much larger Creation-spanning construct. As one of the fundamental forces of the multiverse, the Heroverse harnesses power from a realm beyond itself, this being that the entire multiverse is actually one giant H-Dial, or rather a Multiverse Dial. Each main realm of the Sphere of The Gods + Nil within the Monitor Sphere makes up the Multiversal Dial. When the main villain of the run, Mister Thunderbolt, gained access to the Multiverse-Dial, he breached all the way past the Source Wall and into the Overvoid and saw the multiversal structure as one big H-Dial and had the power to reboot all history at once from outside history, space, and time at the "stank butt-end of the multiverse".

From this point, the heroes of the story Miguel and Summer managed to save/kickstart Superman and his Secret Origin, retroactively introducing (or re-introducing) "Hope" across the multiverse.

Soft Places

Soft Places aren’t a designated realm or construct, but refer to places across Creation where space and time flow like water and give way into doorways into the Void Beyond Creation. The laws that govern matter cease to exist and space-time no longer has any meaning. And passing through one can bring you anywhere from the past or future, or a point where multiple points across time converge at once.

The Greater Omniverse

Past the Source Wall and the multiverse we know lies an even Greater Omniverse, a sublime space of non-dual omni-awareness. There, even the greatest and mightiest ideas in the multiverse can be lost and dissolve in the void outside. Its relationship to the multiverse is akin to how man believes in gods and thus gods exist, so gods believing in the Source beyond the multiverse causes it to exist. It is the aim of the worlds that drift across the Greater Omniverse to reach ascension and join with the Source, otherwise it is sent back to the banks on which it was created. Only when a multiverse has accepted Justice and ascended to a harmonious higher form will it be deemed worthy at the Banks of Judgement.

The World Tree (& Other Aspects of God)

The World Tree, also known as Yggdrasil, is one of the foundations of all Creation. It is the focal point of Creation, and its destruction would threaten other worlds outside the Presence's Creation such as Lucifer's whereas the fading of the Logos wouldn't have reached Lucifer's Cosmos. The path towards Yggdrasil is not a physical one, and is so treacherous that both Lucifer and Michael are injured and weakened significantly trying to make it there. It is the very tree that the world turns around, existing outside of space and time. Every time is the same time by the World Tree. The World Tree being flooded with Michael Demiurgos’ blood accelerated the fading of the Logos from Creation, dissolving all souls into their component parts. And the Tree's death would kill both all existing Creations across the Void, but also prevent any other Creations from being made. The Basanos describe such a thing as a "Great Silence and Stillness" that never ends. When Swamp Thing sensed the World Tree he described it as if it were the full consciousness of the entire Green but far larger as if multiplied a millionfold. It was able to manifest out into the Great Darkness and is the very Root of the Green and so much more. All universes were born from it.

The World Tree is also said to be an Avatar of God, thus making it comparable to all other aspects of the divine. The actual Christ passively generated power comparable to the Crisis on Infinite Earths and could make Swamp Thing part of his grand design for all Creation. When Rita Farr of the Doom Patrol underwent a literal Jesus narrative and reached apotheosis she became one with the entirety of Creation. Her being was pulled as wide as Creation itself and could manifest into the white void outside it, being able to see everything and reboot Creation to save it from destruction by the Eonymous, who she briefly glimpsed in her ascended state. The Avatar is the very essence of the divine presence that takes on human form (like the actual Christ), after Andrew Benedict drank the Blood of Christ and played Kristra's(another form the Avatar takes) flute they caused the Mahaparlya to happen effectively destroying all of creation just like that. The Avatar in its spirit form is also able to guide people back into the Presence but also bring them out dissolving and restoring their individuality. The Holy Grail, due to having once contained the Blood of Christ, now contained all of space and time and became a record of everything that’s ever happened..

The rules of Creation, including the rules binding The Endless, were set by the Council of The First Circle. Glory of The First Circle has another name, Shekinah, which in Hebrew refers to the divine presence of God manifesting on Earth hinting some relation or connection to The Presence. And by the events of Sandman: Overture was shown to be completely unaffected by Dream’s remaking of creation when all other members of the Endless were altered by it. It is by the First Circle that the Endless swear by to uphold promises.

The Logos, the Word of God, sustains all Creation and remained in the faint smudges at the corners of Creation even after ownership of it passed onto Elaine Belloc. The Logos is The Presence's very name is woven into every atom of existence and his departure causes anything still living in The Presence's realm to fade away over time, beginning with creativity and emotions and then the souls of all things rotting and bleeding away into the Void.

The Lightbringer & Dunamis Demiurgos

When The Presence began his creation, Death of The Endless states that Lucifer and Michael were The Presence's very first ideas and initiated the Big Bang for him. Lucifer and Michael are both more powerful than the Endless, Death herself having no claim over them. Their powers, that of the Lightbringer and Dunamis Demiurgos, were the powers the Presence used to create all Creation with Lucifer expressing that these creative powers were equal to The Presence's own.

The Endless also admit inferiority to these two, Dream stating that Lucifer was far more powerful than he is. Death herself only manifests in Lucifer’s Cosmos because he had connected it to The Presence’s Creation and left it open for anyone to enter. He has also been able to reject the fate put onto him by the Basanos. That’s especially important to note when other extensions or replicas of Destiny’s Book like the Book of Possibilities can span the entire library of the Dreaming, write new entries into Destiny’s Book, and contain possibilities Destiny’s Book didn’t contain that he himself wasn’t aware of.

Time and Space are merely extensions of Lucifer’s will, as he and Michael were born in the Time before Time and as later shown the initial moment of Creation lacked Time, which was formed later with how we see Lucifer create Time after the fact in his own Cosmos. Lucifer’s Cosmos stated to be unaffected by the disappearance of The Logos, and Michael’s own demiurgic power can constantly renew and sustain the Logos in every moment of existence which would be reflected in how the script of Destiny’s Book changed following that point. And despite how it’s stated that Destiny’s Book reflects The Presence’s plan, Lucifer on two instances could affect Destiny’s Book. Once managing to burn a page and then writing his name out of the book another time, briefly erasing his existence entirely and changing history as a result, and even then his being was such that everyone he ever personally touched and interacted with could still remember him after he was erased from existence. Things Lucifer set in motion were not changed even though he was no longer in Destiny's Book.

During the events of Lucifer, the rebellious angel would create his own Cosmos in the Void beyond existence by manipulating the energy released by his brother Michael alongside his own divine will. This new Cosmos existed outside of the old one, in its own separate space in the Void with a separate gradient of time. This is further demonstrated with the Basanos, copies of Destiny’s Book who while otherwise are nigh-omniscient within The Presence’s Creation have that specific ability be far more limited and constantly degrading in Lucifer's Cosmos because Destiny's Book only covers what happens in its native Creation. His very existence collapses the Mansions of Silence and Pavilion of The Lanterns, spaces where even The Endless don't appear able to reach and where other angels fly through after they die.

Major angels like Lucifer, Michael, and an unbound Spectre would demonstrate the fact that their existences include other incarnations and aspects of themselves, such as how the Hindu Gods Shiva and Kali exist as aspects of The Spectre and Michael respectively or how Lucifer is Coyote in Navajo myths. Michael being Kali in particular is especially interesting given that Kali is a personification of the Absolute, The True Form of Time, The Beginning and Ending of Everything. The Life and Death of All Creation. All things in the universe, the very fabric of the world, are shaped by Kali, created and destroyed in her hands as she can devour even time itself. When a ritual of hers was performed summoning an aspect of herself within a cassette tape, it was stated that she could bring about the very death of the universe.

Lucifer has also shown that he’s comparable to manifestations or aspects of God within the multiverse. For one, there’s the “False” or “Dark” Presence in Lucifer vol. 2 that exists as an entity formed in the Void and transformed after being struck by the Sword of Azazel and is stated to have a portion of the original Presence’s power, but is explicitly not the original Presence. Despite being powerful enough that he could re-create Michael Demiurgos and his power was later used to make someone else the new "God" of Creation, Lucifer was described as the very opposite to The Presence's purity and ultimately could cut him apart in a fight. Lucifer was made by the Presence to be his shadow in creation as to give his light definition. Without elements of each other, perfect light and dark are the same. He is The Great Beast, a direct aspect of The Great Darkness and has been associated with its hand. Lucifer is the darkness that gives The Presence definition within Creation, and while God still exists he becomes indistinct and no one, not even angels, can perceive his will. Without Lucifer the Word of God, the Logos, cannot be heard.

The Deep Change

Continuing off on our section regarding the Fourth Dimension, the Deep Change exists beyond the Source Wall as an aspect of the Source / Overvoid. All of DC’s multiverse emanates down from it, existing outside everything and impossible to imagine to the denizens of the multiverse. It is a place of no place, a time where time is born from the mere dreams of this realm and all universal forces within the multiverse are born of this time. Multiversal acts such as the death of Darkseid and the multiverse being cut off are mere reflections of events emanated down from this place.

The Deep Change is past all natural knowing and fundamentally unknowable. The most awesome creative force conceivable that sees the multiverse beneath it as a story. It is sustained by Love, which is the Anathema to Math, undetectable to Science, and unknowable to higher planes.

The Eonymous

Final Heaven introduces to us a strange race of beings only known as the Eonymous who all exist outside the multiverse, viewing it and its events as a fiction and entertainment. When a higher-up at Retconn decides the best course of action is to press "the final refresh button" on reality, it's equated/coincides with an Eonymous accidentally putting burning coffee onto the DC Cosmology map. Thus all reality starts burning in from the edges and that what was happening was beyond both Darkseid and Barbatos, both their respective Crisis events reaching all the way up to the Source Wall in influence.

So what do these guys represent? Beats us. Probably something to do with consumerism and how we interact with comics & media but this cosmology section is bloated enough so moving on to…

The Light of Creation & The Great Darkness

The Light is a self-referential void, with it and the Great Darkness requiring one another for reference as they can only refer to each other through the presence of another. Total darkness can only be defined as the absence of light and life. Thus they are pure information, totally incomprehensible because they are the many meanings of everything at once.

Existing both outside the Source Wall and before the Big Bang, when inside of The Source, one realizes that their spirit/inner still point is part of a collective spirit that binds all reality through every nook and cranny of the multiverse, containing all minutes, days, years, epochs, and eternity. It is the end-all-be-all Source of everything. When given the choice to become one with the Source or reincarnate back into the multiverse, Swamp Thing chooses the latter and then the Source reaches out too deep into his energy centers. From Root to Crown, everything oscillates in an implacable pattern that stems from the Source that's needed to be reborn within Time.

The Great Darkness is from where the Light emerged from, once just imperceptible within it before it grew and the Darkness screamed against it, forming the flaw in the Light that would become the Multiverse. It is not inherently malicious. In fact, it enjoys watching the multiverse struggle in fascination, accepting both the glory and undoing of all life. The Great Darkness is incapable of hate, and all the evils associated with it come from the multiverse itself. In Navajo myth, the Darkness is the First World and a tunnel that must be passed through to reach the Light, existing underneath the world of the Light as the lowest layer of the Five Worlds. When all of continuity collapsed in an event considered more disastrous than the Milk Wars, all reality fell into the “Sea of Darkness” underneath everything.

The Void

The Sea of Brahma/the Mahaparlya is the very unconsciousness of God, predating any of the Presence's active mediums. The Mahaparlya is as much of an event as it is a structure acting as the start and end of the Yuga Cycle representing the end of the creation where a new one world forms from it as its beginningless beginning and its end. It is beyond dichotomy and the end of order and chaos.

The Sea of Brahma has also been called the Ocean of Nothingness, from which Brahma emerged. It is Void itself and Lucifer states it is "infinitely familiar" to where he was created, believing he could escape The Presence's plan after falling into it. When exposing the angel Raguel to it, he also recognized it as identical to the Void before creation, when all existed in Yahweh's will unified in nothingness, before specificity and definition existed.

Interestingly enough, the Sea of Brahma has been referred to directly as the Source in the scan above. While the Source has been equated with the Light of Creation, the very recent New Gods run by Ram V establishes that the Source in its purest form is a place of "pre-creation" that existed even before the Light of Creation and Great Darkness. JMD would also introduce the idea in his own run that the Source and the Void Beyond Voids (the one from Lucifer) are one and the same, with the Spectre briefly becoming one with it and describing it as the Cosmic Emptiness or Nothingness that existed before thought. It exists beyond the threshold of conscious limitations. By becoming one with it, individual identity is transcended and one connects to the Logoz, the Oversoul itself. The Divine Presence that surpasses everyone and everything in Creation, to which it sees as a minor drifting thought in the sea of eternity

The Void Beyond Voids/Outside Creation isn’t a space of non-existence. The Jin En Mok, the survivors of the First Cosmos, describe the Void beyond creation as unstuck from “time and space and causality shit” and is literally nowhere. Cosmologically speaking, it's the "ground floor" that Creation sits on. When Lucifer decides to fly out into the Void, it’s stated that there is, has been, and will be nothing in the Void. No time or space exists here. Only under the supernatural willpower of Lucifer Morningstar can one perceive that they aren't really there, such as the infinite possibilities of how he could have exited Creation and flown out into the Void. Creations rise and fall all across the Void and one can travel to past and future Creations as they all exist and come and go at the same time inside the Void, seeming to fill it and yet all the space each Creation occupies amounts to zero compared to the infinity and eternal nature of the Void. The lack of subjectiveness and absoluteness within the Void means that one cannot tell if they have become part of the emptiness of the Void or not.

Now a common belief in the community is that the Void represents a space outside of The Presence and his plan due to how he greets Lucifer and says he has left the plan. This however is a misconception, as we know the Void and The Presence are one and the same, the former just yet another manifestation of the latter, and there’s plenty of evidence for this in the first Lucifer series alone. In fact in that exact same conversation, The Presence explains that Lucifer’s actions and attempts to escape The Presence up until that point was akin to the story of Sun Wukong trying to prove he was beyond the scope of the Buddha only to discover he had been in his hand the entire time.

The Presence’s throne in Heaven, the Primum Mobile, exists in the Void and only a portion of its infinity exists within Heaven. From his "Vantage Point of Eternity", The Presence had always foreseen that Lucifer would go out into the Void and make his own Cosmos and watch him craft it. And on top of having always foreseen this it’s also mentioned that because Lucifer is a creation of The Presence, anything Lucifer creates still counts as a creation of The Presence, including all of Lucifer's own Cosmos. Good and Evil are concepts that exist above even Lucifer, eternal principles on which all things are built and he cannot manipulate due to being just a part of an even greater being. Essentially events across the Void were still part of The Presence’s Plan, which is interesting to note when considering that Destiny's Book doesn't cover what happens to alternate Creations like Lucifer's Cosmos. The final issue equates both The Presence and the Void as infinite and eternal in the same way.

To emphasize again The Presence themselves say that every event until then had been part of their grand plan to have someone escape it, which Lucifer only does at the very end of Carey’s run as it’s otherwise Elaine Belloc and Lilith who make it to The Presence and decide the fate of both Lucifer’s and The Presence’s Creations. This is despite the fact that both Elaine Belloc and Lilith had exited the Void and the latter’s past self in the Barrowjane even appears in the final issue, but they are only considered to have left The Presence’s plan chronologically much later and they both do so despite still being inside Creation, suggesting that The Presence’s plan isn’t limited even by the scope of the Void and is something else entirely. It is implied instead that escaping The Presence’s plan involves randomness, something he breaks whenever he tries to interact with it, rather than going out into the Void.

The very “Mind of God” is the absolute reference point for all Creation, because when measured against it distance is zero and time is always now. The Mind of God extends out into the Void, and Creation is just a distraction within it, a floating idea in the Void. To The Presence, he has played out every iteration of Creation before, each one akin to a glass bubble he blew.

Anything The Presence does is in Ab Aeterno, from the beginning of time. If he had gone through with the destruction of Creation with Lilith’s argument then technically nothing would have ever died because nothing had ever been created to begin with, as well as putting an end to all possibilities of Creation. When The Presence passes on his Creation to Elaine Belloc, he states that she will either become him or something else entirely. And when both Lucifer's and The Presence's Creations are dropped into Elaine's, she suddenly undergoes apotheosis (despite already having the Dunamis Demiurgos mind you) and ascends into being the new God. The Founder, Preserver, and Arbiter. Elaine's new existence expands throughout all Creation, which now may as well be her herself.

So all in all, the Sea of Brahma/The Void Beyond Voids is none other than the very mind of God that Creation floats upon as a thought.

The Divine Presence

 

Also known as the Ain Soph, The Unknowable, or The Smile, The Presence is the primal force behind and beyond everything in DC Cosmology. Before Light and Dark, the Firmament could not be distinguished. Only when The Divine Presence had decided to divide things between the Firmament Above and the Firmament Below, or as commonly retold: the separation of the Great Darkness from the Light of Creation.

Everything is a dream brought forth by the Presence, so that His love may find expression, they are the very Smile behind creation, beyond the Mahapralaya. The act of creation is equated with an ocean of love roaring outwards into shapes, forms, and energies within that ocean as everything emerges from a sea of love. All that exists outwardly exists simultaneously within, the breath of fire that births and differentiates the Light and Darkness returning back to the Smile as the thing that is behind, beyond, and within it all. It contains all gods and all things, transcending them all and those in-between.

Beings like the Spectre and New Gods like Scott Free have both recognized that the Source and the Presence are but one and the same, both simply names referring to the same thing. For Jack Kirby, the Source was the ultimate ground of being. The Ain Soph Aur, beyond all divisions and definitions.

Note: For those interested in where what specific tiers these land here is a spreadsheet showing of the relevant structures and their tiers

How Does Trigon Scale To All Of This?

While there isn’t much precedent to scale Trigon to absolutely everything like the voids beyond the Source Wall, we believe it is more than acceptable to scale Trigon to both the most powerful entities in the Collective Unconscious. Lords of Hell and both minor and unnamed gods have been compared directly to The Endless, who have all admitted powerlessness when being forced to interact in the domains of other gods and Dream himself has been overthrown by gods invading the Dreaming. Weaker demons like Etrigan are feared by the Lords of Chaos and Lords of Order like Dr. Fate has been portrayed as comparable to mystical powers like Trigon before. The layers of the realms would be pretty straight forward from the Heroverse < Sphere of The Gods < Collective Unconscious, making Trigon two layers into Outerversal.

Going completely out of left field there are no-name angels who traversed and lifted the entirety of the Presence’s Creation and dropped it all into Elaine Belloc’s, as well as the Titans Gyges and Garamas being able to trace the shape of The Presence when He left the multiverse and determined its full size. Given how no-name demons and no-name angels are treated as even with one another and how Etrigan could fight the angels Remiel and Duma when they were assigned to be Lords of Hell, there’s no reason for Trigon not to scale to the entire multiversal structure up to the Source Wall based on their feats. This would add the two realms over the Collective Unconscious, the Divine Continuum and then The Snyder-Time dimensions bringing us to four layers into Outerversal.

Going for the absolute high-end, it’s possible Trigon’s authority within the Dark Dimension may be comparable to the likes of the Endless, and aspects of Death of The Endless like the Black Racer could kill Darkseid during Darkseid War, a point where he was amped to the degree that he could face a COIE-level Anti-Monitor, whose weakened state as Mobius was still stronger than God of Gods Shazam who no-diffed Yuga Khan shortly after he punched a hole in the Source (specifically the afterlife of Old Gods) to re-enter the multiverse. This would scale Trigon’s peak, or perhaps the peak of power nullification against invaders within his domain, to the level of the Greater Omniverse. This is the highest he should be able to go given it’s otherwise noted by The Monitor that Trigon and others comparable like Anton Arcane and the Spectre are weaker than the Anti-Monitor. Making him at best baseline High Outerversal.

For more explanation, please read the Verdict.

Crossover Cosmology?!

In the very recent Storm: Earth’s Mightiest Mutant series, Marvel has now formally introduced a new definition of the “Omniverse” described as "The collection of all multiverse clusters to have ever been featured in a narrative--including the one you exist in, dear reader." And as Storm is flung through the Omniverse, she passes through the Cthulhu Mythos, Jujutsu Kaisen, Gatchiakuta, the Image Comics Universe (possibly just Youngbloods), Saga, before being shot back to the Marvel Multiverse, referred to as The One Above All's Multiverse Cluster. 

And where was she shot from? Well, Storm was transported to a multiverse containing a certain Wall that acted as the border of its multiverse, encountering a very familiar Cosmic Raptor…

Outside of explicit crossovers, Storm is far from the first person to find themselves outside their home multiverse and into another’s. Much earlier than this, a certain blonde speedster with a torn red and white spandex found themselves on Earth-616 whose name sounds something close to "Buried Alien".

Indeed, both Marvel and DC have referenced each other a lot over the decades, but beyond Marvel’s Omniverse definition the recent Batman/Deadpool crossover has also explained that such crossovers occur when the embodiments of the Marvel and DC multiverse clusters in the form of Eternity and Kismet perform the “dance with no pants”, happening high enough over both cosmologies that it baffles even in-universe author avatars like The Writer as to what's causing the crossover.

Of course, take this all with a big grain of salt as under technicality this would be a more 1-sided explanation for how Marvel connects to DC’s multiverse and not the other way around, but it is still fun to note nonetheless and DC authors have themselves toyed with the idea that the Marvel universe exists somewhere out past the Source Wall. So beyond official crossovers it’s fingers crossed we can get DC’s side of their answer sometime sooner than later!

Weaknesses

Dormammu

As overwhelmingly powerful as he is, even the Dread Dormammu has his limits. While he is able to traverse many realms, he has limits as to where he can travel to. An example of that includes the realm of the Marvel Zombies, which Dormammu was mystically barred from entering.

Dormammu also has been proven to be vulnerable to exorcisms, but only from Doctor Strange and high level magicians comparable to him, which includes Hellstorm. Domammu’s magic can also be ineffective against beings who are pure of heart, like when The Ancient One created a forcefield to protect Strange and Sofia from his magic when it was used by Mordo. Similarly, if beings are able to join in perfect harmony and genuine bond, they have greater advantage over him. This is also consistent with other Hell Lords like Mephisto having the exact same limitation. A large sum of his power is tied to the Dark Dimension. If he is cut off from his throne, he becomes vastly weaker. He has also been fooled by illusions from Loki. 

While Dormammu may have a lot of support by his side, his allies are not always obedient. The Hood for example, has not always followed Dormammu’s orders, even when fully under his influence. Even his sister doesn’t always remain loyal to him given that they have conflicted and betrayed each other in the past. Like when these two siblings mystically bonded to become even stronger, Umar used this opportunity to betray Dormammu and sap his power away. Loki has also used Squirrel Girl’s powers to force all the squirrel souls out of Dormammu to force him to retreat.

But believe it or not, Dormammu’s flaming head is actually a weak spot, sort of. If Dormammu’s flame is fully extinguished, it will temporarily restrain him. While this might sound stupid at first glance, it’s easier said than done, as it required multiple powerful hell lords joining together to attempt to do so in the past.

Perhaps his biggest weakness of all, Dormammu is REALLY obsessed with proving himself superior to Stephen Strange. His fixation on proving as such has driven him to lose more battles than he can count because he just won’t pull the trigger until it's too late. This is especially egregious when he managed to usurp Eternity but refused to use it to kill Doctor Strange, insisting he suffer first which led to Strange eventually forming a plan to dupe him and led to a really fed up Umar betraying him and draining him of Eternity’s power (though Umar does state Strange could have beaten Eternity-Dormammu anyways).

Also, Dormammu’s most recent appearance in Sorcerer Supreme #5 had the Hell-Lord get a literal, physical heart forced onto him by Wanda Maximoff in spite of his usual non-material existence to deter him from even entering the Dark Dimension. As a result that heart, like any normal heart, can suffer from severe palpitations which Wanda caused by linking it to his niece Donna’s baby rattle. Given this was not removed as of his latest appearance… yeah go get those heart meds old man.

Trigon

Although he is one of the most powerful demonic entities in the DC multiverse, Trigon is far from invincible and has his fair share of weaknesses. Leading with overwhelming strength has meant that Trigon has little experience in battling an equal, thus losing in hand-to-hand when Raven faced him after attaining a similar level of power by combining with the Dark-Winged Angel and the Titans. Raven in general may be one of his biggest weaknesses as it is implied that he possesses a "spark of decency" that kept him from killing Raven and allowed her to push him into sparing the Teen Titans and the Earth (temporarily he was gonna go back for the Earth anyway lmao). Demon physiology is also noted to be vulnerable to specific human emotions such as grief or yearning, causing them to writhe in pain. Being imbued with regret and guilt is something even Dukes of Hell cannot remove. Arella is also shown to be able to use her empathic abilities to weaken Trigon, which brought him to his knees despite him somewhat resisting her. Enough goodness can be nauseating to demons and even prevent them from touching someone. Even powerful demons like Neron could be killed when exposed to pure and selfless souls such as that of Shazam’s, needing to place his mark on someone else beforehand for his soul to return, and powerful enough love such as the love between Wally and Linda West. People with strong willpower can transcend and escape the torment of Hell.

Trigon can also have his powers limited in a variety of ways. Since the moment he was first introduced, Trigon usually cannot access our dimension without outside help, prep time or absorbing a huge amount of souls to breach the barriers between worlds. Trigon being able to be trapped in other dimensions is a weakness that has mostly remained consistent throughout the years. After he killed the Divine, the barrier they created remained which he couldn't pass through forcing him to find an alternate means of escaping the dimension. In one of his conquests he faced the warrior Alazandria, who wore armor that was passed down through generations that resisted Trigon's powers which made it impossible for him to defeat her. Raven also states that the priests of Azarath taught her that prayer, meditation and faith can help her resist Trigon's influence. 

Holy weapons, rites, or spells generally have been shown to be effective against demons, melt demons’ bodies like First of The Fallen, and trap and restrain even kings of Hell like New-52 Lucifer. Relics like the Holy Grail can nullify powerful evil relics like Eclipso’s Black Diamond and the touch of Jesus Christ can exorcise and alter the fates of demons like Etrigan. Soul-based weaponry like Katana’s Soulsword can trap demons within it. Demons are also generally weak to extreme cold, which weakens to where it can be fatal under prolonged exposure. Even being engulfed in hellfire cannot immediately counteract the effects even though it can normally rejuvenate them from near-death. Cold-based spells like generating icicle storms could kill the hellhound Cerberus despite it being strong enough to knock back Superman. When the Spectre hosted by Asmodel stole all the hellfire in Hell, it caused the entire realm to freeze over and trap demons that didn't invade Earth like Neron. Demons also appear to have no inherent resistances to poisons or chemicals which appears to be kinda consistent with angels being vulnerable to supernatural smallpox. Lastly for other misc. weaknesses, even kings of Hell are vulnerable to anti-magic like the Waters of Avalon, depowering the likes of New-52 Lucifer and his entire demon horde forcing him to retreat back to Hell.

And while Trigon’s immortality and regeneration are certainly great abilities to have, they aren't perfect. While he can come back from the dead, even when his body and soul were vanquished, it takes time for him to return as seen on panel in Titans 2008 all the way through the present off panel in the Post-Flashpoint era which obviously is not ideal if you want to continue a fight you were having. It's also worth noting that during our research demons regeneration abilities were called into question and left some of us with differing opinions on their limits and what to buy for Trigon’s capabilities to heal his wounds in battle (more Before The Verdict)

Trigon is also not the end-all-be-all power of Hell. Like many other realms, Hell has rules to be followed and if Trigon were to violate these rules and abuse Hell’s power then he's subject to being demoted in rank and power. Hell’s hierarchy is prone to change due to the ambitions of powerful demons, and if overpowered and overthrown even the mightiest demons can be exiled and forced to leave Hell or be tossed into the abyss farther down in Hell.

Lastly, like with any living being he also possesses a level of water/blood amount within him that the likes of Aqualad was able to manipulate and essentially gave him a heart attack via bloodbending, which weakened him to the point of being defeated by Raven. This is consistent with other powerful demons being vulnerable to having the water contents in their body being transmuted into molten lead, which immediately kills them and the exact same happens when Firestorm turns the water content of a demon into cement (Neron is later unaffected by Firestorm’s transmutation in the same story, but notably because he placed a barrier around himself when they fought).

So tl;dr - Trigon is a Katara victim.

Before the Verdict

How do Vibrations & Frequencies in DC work?

Similar to how Marvel has treated Gamma Rays & Cosmic Rays as emanations of The One Below/Above All, DC has (albeit more obscurely) referenced vibrations and frequencies in the context of its higher metaphysical realms as clearly non-physics based.

In JLA/Spectre: Soul War, higher vibrations and frequencies when discussing the Collective Unconscious don't refer to their physics-based definition, but a mental and spiritual one. Frequencies in this context echo directly from the mind, lacking physicality and transcending space and time. Higher vibrations are non-local and cannot be measured by either time nor distance. In The Flash vol. 6 #4, when Wally enters the Gallery of Moments, it's described as a realm deeper than time or space & is conceptual in nature. Yet, vibrations are stated to exist here and the Garden is just the "slowest vibration". And famously the Multiversity map assigns vibrational waves all the way up to the Source Wall, even though on the side describing each layer the Speed Force Wall is stated to be "the limit to matter" and Limbo is where "matter and memory break down".

Fundamentally, vibrations in physics just describe the motion of particles (& frequency being the rate of vibrations) which can’t occur if the spaces we’re talking about are repeatedly stated to lack space or time, and “spatial” coordinates in places like the Godsphere are measured in concepts like “fate” or “disaster” and explicitly distinct from how space or time is measured. Recent comics have also introduced the idea that the “math” in spiritual realms isn’t normal scientific math, but “Soul-Science” such as Life - Life = Death, Grandma + Tammy = Love, or Grandma + Food + Tammy = Joy2 in the vein of something like the Anti-Life Equation and such.

Anti-Feats for DC?

Imps

Imps are frequently referenced as affected by vibrations and temporal pincer attacks, however it’s worth pointing out that essentially all of these instances are when they are acting within the multiverse. It is incredibly consistent, especially in Grant Morrison’s body of work, that whenever Imps manifest within the multiverse that they take on limited forms compared to their usual selves in the Fifth Dimension. The Imp Vyndktvx explains that while he’s in the multiverse he’s constricted and limited interacting with things beneath the Fifth Dimension, and later both the Legion and Superman explain he’s entangled with matter and has a flawed perspective while in the multiverse. To be able to interact with it at all and another Imp Nyxly has stated Imps need to shed their existences to enter reality. Whenever the Gentry manifest in the Multiversity storyline, Grant Morrison describes it as such:

By entering the text to attack the hero, however, Intellectron makes himself vulnerable to criticism! I had fun creating the kind of internet critique that tends to be lobbed my way! The smart arsed alchemical symbolism seen as nothing more than a ‘5-DIMENSIONAL evil egg! LOL!!!!’

Intellectron is now trapped in the comic, like a fly on sticky paper but even within those limits he can still do damage. He can still hurt Ultra Comics and more importantly still reach through the Multi-Mind into Earth-Prime!

So anti-feats like Mickey Mxyzptlk for instance being affected and imprisoned through String Theory, losing to 10-D beings / needing amps to reach 10-D, or being attacked simultaneously across time can just be explained away as them being nerfed while acting within the multiverse. It also goes without saying that Imps vary wildly in power per appearance. Sometimes Mxyz is just barely on par with Trigon, is treated as comparable to Ares, or is fighting so hard against Bat-Mite that they nearly wipe out the entire multiverse beneath the Sixth Dimension. So limitations demonstrated by their avatars within the multiverse shouldn’t be taken as a limit for Imps themselves.

Time

If you’ve noticed, DC loves to play around with the concept of Hypertime and chronology a lot. So much so that the Snyder Dimensions at the top of the verse all define themselves by how Time exists in each of them. So in total fairness, it would be totally understandable that you cap DC within the Source Wall at Low Outerversal as a result. However, as many times you hear that xyz realms deal with temporal stuff, you then get statements like Hypertime existing outside of time, the Speed Force being detached from time, the Sphere of The Gods lacking time, and hell even the Fourth Dimension lacking time. So what gives?

Well for the most part it’s that these higher temporal realms aren’t just talking about time but also the meta-nature of continuity in comics. To Grant Morrison, the writer of a lot of this stuff, the "geometries" of time he introduced are meant to reach into our real life world and demonstrate our real perspective on comics. Cube Time, a lesser form of time than Hypertime, granted Animal Man his power to perceive the 4th Wall and see the reader. Being a more advanced time traveler is equivalent to being a continuity traveler, and people who break the 4th wall with meta-powers are then considered Fourth Dimensional.

Dream/Tree of Life

People have brought up the Sefirot making an appearance within The Dreaming Vol. 2 that somehow it’s evidence that all of reality only exists within the lowest sphere of the Sefirot, Malkuth. The argument being that Dream supposedly was being erased and had to remake himself by forcing his essence to descend down the paths of the Tree of Life until he reaches Malkuth, allowing him to reconstitute himself within the Dreaming, showing that the Endless are all contained within Malkuth.

The issue is that this is a complete misreading of what is happening. Or rather, one would have not read The Dreaming vol. 2 for one to interpret the events this way because there’s rather really big context being left out. Most damning of all: The Sefirot doesn’t actually exist as a cosmological structure in this storyline.

The Sefirot in this story specifically was not a literal structure representing the Tree of Life, but rather a sigil that was etched onto Dream’s back. Essentially, a billionaire seeking to re-write the collective unconscious wanted to trap Dream akin to how he was initially trapped in the 1800s (explicitly basing his plan off that initially). When Dream manifested on the Earth to pursue a love interest, he was inadvertently shackled by having the symbols of the Tree of Life & the Dreamcatcher onto his back, shackling and poisoning Dream’s existence given he himself is essentially a living symbol. It was the combo of a symbol representing the downwards flow of divine energy along with another symbol that literally catches dreams that was killing Dream to where he had to escape to a new Creation to survive as outlined in the DC Cosmology section.

If DC has introduced a proper Tree of Life analogy to its cosmology the same way Marvel has that we somehow missed, then that’s our bad. However this specific example and the argument around it overall completely leaves out the greater context of the story that no cosmological structure representing the Tree of Life was involved at all, and that if anything the symbol of the entire Tree of Life was needed to weaken Dream over time (though really again it’s not applicable as a debunk to feats nor cosmology, more so a symbolic weakness the Endless have).

The Presence Scaling?

An argument that’s been mentioned from time to time regarding scaling for notable demons of Hell like Trigon was that the First of The Fallen stated when he’s ready to don his armor that it means he’s ready to go to war with Heaven and that the armor was made to fight him. This has then been extrapolated by members of the community and even other blogs into meaning that The First of The Fallen is confident he can challenge The Presence, and thus other characters comparable to him like Doomsday or members of the Triumvirate of Hell (like Trigon) scale to him, which in turn branches out into a whole host of characters now receiving “Presence-scaling” due to the nature of chain-scaling.

We believe this is a very poor argument for one reason. A very rebellious reason:

To put bluntly, Lucifer is the stop gap to any such argument. At least as far as attempting to do so via the First of The Fallen statement, given Lucifer’s status as second only to The Presence in power, at least when talking about Heaven and Hell. Members of Hell’s upper echelons and the Triumvirate of Hell like Neron and Belial have statements where they think they’re relative to Lucifer, but in Etrigan vol. 3, Lucifer is shown to be completely unbothered and unthreatened when Etrigan ascended to being sole King of Hell and later referenced his rebellion as something he let happen for fun. When Etrigan later gains Hell’s Crown of Horns, an artifact powerful enough to let him 1-shot an Archangel, on top of all of Hell acknowledging him as its king, he’s still unable to harm Lucifer whatsoever and Lucifer thought Etrigan was a disappointment.

As a reminder in the same story where the First of The Fallen says his armor was made to fight The Presence, he also says Doomsday was reaching a point where he was going to become King of Hell when Hell’s denizens believed him to be so. The fact that Etrigan literally goes through the same thing and is propped up as King of Hell after overthrowing its previous rulers and receives an additional amp on top of that, yet is completely incapable of so much as even scratching Lucifer, should speak volumes to how much more powerful Lucifer is.

In the same Midnighter & Apollo series where Neron says Apollo hits harder than Lucifer, he got his butt beat by Midnighter accessing a sliver of power from the angel Asmodel, who is “merely” a Major of Heaven, a position lower than an Archangel. Neron was also probably referring to New-52 Lucifer given Stormwatch referenced the New-52 Lucifer incarnation, who’s completely different from the original Lucifer returning from the Void in Holly Black’s run. New-52 Lucifer was imprisoned in Hell during and after the Midnighter & Apollo run in The Demon: Hell is Earth where he finally dies in issue #6 to Etrigan while OG Lucifer stayed on Earth to rebuild Ex Lux with Mazikeen. So without a doubt, these are two completely different Lucifers, if the vastly different design, history, and personality weren’t already dead giveaways.

Additionally while Jim Corrigan Spectre was briefly able to exchange blows with Michael as mentioned in the scaling section, they do have a first earlier fight where Michael tanks a blow from an unbound Spectre and then immediately 1-shots him. Suggesting that the fight with Jim Corrigan was him holding back given how easily Michael can dispatch an unbound Spectre. Even looking at that first fight, Spectre really only lands one hit in before Michael flicks him away.

The Host of Heaven believed that while their entirety would eventually prevail against Lucifer even after he got his wings back, just fighting him alone would bring about severe repercussions and result in heavy casualties. Remember that this was with every single Archangel minus Michael on their side. And speaking of, this actually goes double for Michael Demiurgos, whose own Dunamis Demiurgos is stated to be able to wipe out the entirety of the Host of Heaven if he really wanted to and could only be harmed when he was holding back and caught off-guard (the release of all of Michael's power is something Lucifer tanked btw). Even a weakened Lucifer would threaten all of Heaven if he was backed by all other afterlives and underworlds. Later on in the run it takes the forces of Hell plus Lilith’s army of Lilim, further bolstered by having Fenris Wolf, the concept of Destruction that could fight a weakened Lucifer by himself, on their side to match Heaven. And earlier on in the run, the Lilim attempted to intimidate Lucifer with the total size of their whole army but he was unphased because, per his own words:

“I am my own army. A million times more numerous than yours.”

And to top it all off Lucifer’s mentioned to Dream that if he wanted to, he could wipe out all of Hell at once casually. So to argue that the First of The Fallen isn’t just boasting about himself you’d have to argue that he’s stronger than Lucifer, which he isn’t. Even if you argue he is relative to Lucifer by virtue of having been a part of the Triumvirate of Hell (which doesn’t equate to being even remotely equal to Lucifer as mentioned before), that’s still a very vast gap power-wise given that The Presence near the end of the original Lucifer run could have unmade both his Creation and Lucifer’s Cosmos casually if he was convinced to do so, with Lucifer in it.

Oh also Trigon just loses to The Presence off-screen in Phantom Stranger: Futures End. L Bozo.

Trigon’s Inconsistent Immortality/Regeneration?

As mentioned in his weaknesses section, Trigon in his most recent appearances along with demons as a whole have had a bit of a shake up in regards to their physiology, specifically how capable they are of regenerating and surviving fatal injuries which ultimately makes Trigon's immortality a bit weird and inconsistent, allow us to explain.

Firstly, we’ll briefly review some of the showcases of demons being able to regenerate and survive major bodily harm. Starting with Trigon himself, he has extended his bones out of his body to snatch Raven and was able to return his body to normal with no issue as well as being stabbed through the head by Red Robin's wings which he quickly regenerated the wounds to. Moving onto the feats of his sons: the oldest and strongest, Belial in his fight against the Titans survived getting his heart ripped out by Raven, which she said would regenerate in moments (even if it incapacitated him) as well as regrew his sliced off hands in moments after they were sliced off by Red Robin. His brothers have impressive showings as well with Suge intentionally stabbing himself through the head during poker and alongside Ruskoff, got their heads sliced off and were able to survive just fine, with one of them carrying their head around while the other simply reattached it off screen. Belial even ordered them immediately to reattach their heads because they looked ridiculous, implying that losing their heads is no big deal which as already mentioned was seen to be true in practice. Etrigan has also survived getting stabbed through multiple parts of his body including his hands and the head.

However, two of Trigon's most recent appearances: Red Hood and the Outlaws and the Dark-Winged Queen arc of Titans, along with demons as a species have seemingly been interpreted differently in regards to their capability to regenerate. Starting with Trigon, in Red Hood and the Outlaws, Trigon faces Bizarro in battle. While pinning Bizarro down, Trigon unknowingly gives him the opportunity to freeze and shatter the demon's hand and later on when the fight ends, Bizarro emerges victorious. How you may ask? By flying through Trigon’s body and ripping out his heart, killing him in the process. In the Dark-Winged Queen arc after being beaten in close quarters by Raven fused with the Dark-Winged Queen and the Titans, Garth manipulates the blood inside Trigon, giving him a heart attack and weakening him even further. As Trigon pleads with his daughter, she stabs him through the heart, causing him to fade away. Onto other demons: the Sons of Trigon all appear in The Demon: Hell is Earth as the main antagonists to Etrigan, who wants to overthrow his father, Belial and become the King of Hell. First he faces Ruskoff whom he kills by snapping his neck and then ripping his head off. Next he faces Suge, who is too distracted restraining Etrigan to notice he’s about to be blasted into smithereens and meets his end via the huge blast of energy, being completely disintegrated. Lastly, Etrigan faces Belial and after a hard fought battle, Etrigan is able to slice off both of Belial's hands and to finish him off, decapitates his father, killing him and succeeding in taking Hell's throne for himself. This is very much in-line with Etrigan’s Pre-Flashpoint run where he rips Belial’s heart out and that left him weakened until he could get a replacement. Then later in the run Etrigan, Lobo, and Morax just beat Belial to death, then Lobo ripped out Belial’s replacement heart, then they incinerated Merlin and buried them both together and neither showed up again for the duration of the run. A disguised Merlin was also dismembered and mutilated earlier by Lobo and required Belial’s help to put himself back together.

One thing that has remained consistent about demons across our research is their ability to come back from the dead or “fading away” as Raven put it when she defeated Trigon most recently. There's the statement that demons can take up to a thousand years for them to reform if they’re torn apart sufficiently enough and other entities from the Sphere of The Gods/Collective Unconscious similarly take years to revive such as angels or even the New Gods. However, Trigon as well as his sons have shown the ability to return much faster than that. The most infamous example for Trigon is after his spirit was destroyed, when he returned in his realm (Raven says it's been a few years since she faced him) at a tenth of his former strength while looking absolutely cursed and there are other examples where he has come back from death without the severe decrease in his power in the Post-Flashpoint era. Similarly Belial and Suge were shown to have returned in the Dark-Winged Queen arc after their dismemberment and deaths at the hands of Etrigan. It is worth noting once again that despite their ability to resurrect being much faster than the thousand years' statement, it still wouldn’t be instantaneous or fast enough to continue a battle as seen with all the examples above.

Soundtrack

(Mediocre Productions)

Check out this fanmade original soundtrack made for this fight by our very own Frenchhoaxide; Hell’s Crown!

Verdict

Stats

Dormammu and Trigon are some of the most terrifying threats in Marvel and DC, and their conquests have led them to cross paths with the universe’s strongest to offer; their heaviest of hitters, their most mystic mages, and their most revered telepaths. Both of them at worst are still repeatedly described as threats to the universe, with Dormammu having the ability to absorb dimensions into himself to make him grow stronger, and Trigon still being able to destroy a single universe at just 1/10th of his power. Both of them have held off entire legions of heroes with their might, such as Dormammu effortlessly dispatching the Defenders, which includes the likes of Doctor Strange, Silver Surfer, the Hulk, and even Ghost Rider. Trigon has repeatedly bested the Teen Titans and Justice League, which include heavy hitters like Raven, Superman, the Flash, Wonder Woman, and Green Lantern. Though at a multiversal level (which is still a bit of a low end), Dormammu has a bit more consistency, threatening to melt all of creation into a cauldron and being called a multiversal threat to all dimensions, of which there are an infinite amount of in Marvel. Trigon has absorbed the Heart, which has leveled entire universes, but besides that, his earlier stories seem to imply a more universal level of power, though that changes with time and with scaling. 

When you examine the scaling and statements of power at mid to higher levels of power, things get a little trickier, and there is some overlap with scaling to certain characters alongside scaling to different parts of the verses’ respective cosmologies. Let’s break it down at the low to mid to high end to capture the entire picture;

Low-End

Dormammu: One avenue of scaling is granted from Dormammu’s status as a Hell Lord. Realms such as Limbo and Hell make up these nightmarish domains, and Dormammu has certainly gone toe-to-toe to many threats of this realm. For starters, other Hell Lords such as Mephisto have entire domains that they rule, which can encompass entire universes. The Dark Dimension, Dormammu’s realm, is considered the largest fragment of these Splinter Realms, which has more spatial dimensions than man’s universe and exists beyond the trans-finite multiverse itself. Given Dormammu sustains this realm and often uses the entire Dark Dimension as a power boost, his level of power is already far above the normal multiversal levels of power, as the Inner/Outer Planes and Splinter Realms completely supersede Marvel’s multiverse, with the three of them plus the Superflow granting him four layers of Outerversal. 

Trigon: Similarly speaking, Trigon is a Lord of Hell with his own domain, which already makes him a huge threat to many Heavenly beings within the Collective Unconscious. The Endless themselves have admitted to being powerless against the domains of Heaven and Hell, specifically the former, with Dream himself being overthrown by gods invading the Dreaming. Demons of Trigon’s lineage such as his grandson Etrigan are considered threats by Dr. Fate, whom Trigon is easily comparable to given he has killed him in a future where he succeeded. Additionally with his true nature being in the Sphere of The Gods, Trigon already reaches a level of power comparable to the Collective Unconscious, giving him two layers of Outerversal. 

Mid-End

Dormammu: As a very powerful magic user, Dormammu has partaken in the War of the Seven Spheres, putting him toe-to-toe with the Vishanti, which includes two Elder Gods and an Old One, beings comparable to Abstracts in power, being able to amp Hercules to be able to beat the Chaos King and poison the Far Shore and possibly the rest of The Outside. The Far Shore exists at the farthest possible border of life, death, and Eternity itself, embodying the same amount of space as the likes of Multi-Eternity, granting another layer of Outerversal, giving him five layers in total.

Trigon: When you go deeper into the echelons of the wars of Heaven and Hell, things take a very interesting turn. Trigon is an upper class demon amongst the demons of Hell, and naturally, angels and demons like Remiel and Etrigan fight very frequently, so what kind of feats do they have? Oh how about four random angels lifting and carrying the entirety of the Presence’s Creation and shipping it to Elaine Belloc’s presence, which includes everything up to the Source Wall itself. With this in mind, this includes everything, including the Divine Continuum and the dimensions of time (as written by Scott Snyder), giving him four layers in total. 

High-End 

Dormammu: Doctor Strange has an extremely powerful feat where he is able to hold together the entirety of the Nexus of All Realities on all levels of reality, holding it together for a decent duration before Man-Thing stepped in and repaired it. The Nexus of All Realities extends nearly everywhere, all the way up to the White Hot Room itself, along with the Land of Couldn’t-Be-Shouldn’t-Be, both of which transcend Overspace, putting Dormammu at two layers into High Outerversal. As a reminder, to qualify for High Outerversal, one must transcend the framework for a normal Outerversal framework entirely, transcending in a qualitative superiority, of which the Macroverse/Overspace achieve this by viewing everything below it as dreams folded inside dreams, and each universe as a thought contained within a larger thought.

Trigon: Trigon’s own authority within his Dark Dimension would make him comparable to the Endless, including the likes of Death of The Endless, which contains aspects of Death itself like Nekron or Black Racer, the latter of which killed Darkseid during the events of Darkseid War, who was amped to such a degree that he could face Anti-Monitor in his COIE incarnation, a being who is still stronger than God of Gods Shazam and Yuga Khan, the latter of whom punched a hole in the Spruce. This is supported by the Crisis on Infinite Earths being an event that caused ripples and cracks into the prime Source Wall itself, at least within his realm. He hits a notable cap at the Anti-Monitor as noted by the Monitors, but his own terror and destruction in alternate timelines and visions ensure that he is somewhere in the ballpark. The Source Wall is an extremely high point in the DC Cosmology where all of creation can be viewed down to the smallest level from it, putting Trigon’s most likely peak at High Outerversal.

It should be noted however that there are arguments against these two getting these far in power beyond simple disagreements with cosmology. For Dormammu, there is an argument to be made that the sustaining Nexus feat Strange pulled off isn’t as powerful of a feat as its said to be due to the Nexus of All Realities acting as a magical leyline, and the Nexuses amplify magic by simply existing, which is what allowed Strange to do it in the first place. It’s also worth pointing out that he has been bested by Abstracts in the past plenty of times, or people on that level of power such as Magik with all of Limbo at her fingertips, Galactus, and Universal Eternity, the latter of whom Dormammu didn’t affect at all in their fight despite seemingly doing so. Thus you could argue that Dormammu’s power would cap somewhere below Overspace as a limitation. 

As for Trigon, lots of his higher end arguments are contingent on his status as a Lord of Hell, and also being in said domain at all times. The Endless arguments in particular are sustained by this very notion, as they are in danger trying to go against the domains of Heaven and Hell, and even the Quintissence thought a similar confrontation with Hell would be risky. Outside of his domain, he has severe limitations in power when it comes to beings such as the Anti-Monitor, and though his power has been vaguely referenced by Nightwing as being comparable to “past attacks on Earth”, you can certainly argue there’s no way to know if Nightwing is actually referring to the First Crisis or Zero Hour, and it's merely an observation since Earth has been invaded and attacked hundreds of times already. 

Overall regardless of what end you buy, please do not see the low or high end as the end all be all, it is always worth more discussion, this is purely if you were to absolutely use equal leeway with others. Similarly speaking, do not run wild saying we think Marvel’s cosmology is > DC’s or vice versa, because neither of these two scale to the full width and scope of their cosmology so answering that now would be quite silly. But regardless of what leeway is given, Dormammu wins at every end. At the low end he is stronger by two layers, at the mid end he is stronger by a single layer, and he is stronger by two layers at the highest end so no matter what, Dormammu takes the edge in stats.

Arsenal/Abilities

As we know, stats aren’t everything. When you’re at this level of power, anything can change on a dime if you haven’t faced certain abilities, or can regenerate at every conceivable level. These two have a good old fashioned powerset of whatever the writer wants to give them at any given moment, but before we get into that, let’s quickly go over support and weapons, or at least specifically the Black Dechantment since that’s the only one that really does anything notable here.

When it comes to their support, neither one of their armies will be all too useful. While someone like Umar may seem like an additional bonus, Umar is Dormammu’s twin sister; their entire lives have been a heated rivalry, trying to take the throne of the Dark Dimension, and Dormammu insulting her to-be husband at her own wedding. She isn’t exactly the most loyal support to have, and she is just as capable of leaving the fight even if she is forcibly summoned. On the off chance she does decide to work with her brother though, they can synchronize their power to gain a significant boost, though Trigon also has ways of amping himself with his own support and soul absorbing abilities. Similarly speaking, the Sons of Trigon aren’t the most loyal to their Pops, often taking away his energy from him or playing card games with millions of universes colliding into them. The Mindless Ones, despite being infinite in scope, can be matched by Trigon’s own ability to make the living flesh in terms of their more fodder army, and both troops can fight heavy hitters like Superman and Thor. The rest of their demons or minions like Baron Mordo would ultimately be useless against Dormammu and Trigon themselves, who are far more powerful overall.

To recap, the Black Dechantment is a stone that Dormammu acquired while sifting through history, which he used to turn magic users into Mindless Ones, infecting the likes of Iron Man and Doctor Doom. The Black Dechantment can bypass magical resistances, and can fire off these attacks as bullets or chunks. While Trigon’s abilities aren’t really magic-based, there is an important implication here. Dormammu can fire these Black Dechantment chunks from the Dark Dimension to Asgard so fast that Heimdall couldn’t even see it coming, which corrupted him and shattered the Bitfrost. Asgard, along with the other Nine Realms are higher dimensional planes of existence from Earth, meaning Dormammu’s range is tremendously larger, being able to attack from the Dark Dimension without having to really engage in the fight, though the Black Dechantment itself affecting Trigon is unlikely.

As for Trigon’s own Dark Dimension, while he can’t attack from it, he can certainly see from it across all of time and realities, so he gains a comparable edge in that department.

Now let’s get back to powers. With so many abilities and resistances, let’s whittle it down until we get to the most important factors of the fight, starting with what cancels out completely.

What Cancels Out

At the top of the funnel, let’s filter out everything that doesn’t really matter here. Abilities that whether or not they resist, both have it, and both could use it, though for some abilities it is debatable on who would open with it first.

Magic Senses: Dormammu is able to see visions of the future and past, see past magical cloaking, and track magic signatures. Trigon can see foes watching from Wintersgate Mansion, a point that exists in all eras of time, sense Raven’s energy signature, and see through illusionists due to sensing magic, so any attempt from the other to hide themselves will likely fail.

Mind Control/Telepathy: Both of these characters have mind-controlled many powerful heroes, such as Magik or Raven, and can enter the minds of foes to toy with their fears, emotions, and subconsciously manipulate their every move. Both can also do this at a range that is across entire universes, and both have resisted mind-based attacks in the past so this wouldn’t really be a game changer.

Elemental Abilities: Dormammu can call upon the Winds of Watoomb and cast dehydration spells, and Trigon has used lava and made worldwide storms.

Reality Warping: Dormammu can reality warp entire universes to his whim, and bend souls with this ability as well. Trigon can tear down dimensional walls between his realm and Earth, absorb dimensions, and undo damage done in his vicinity when within Hell or said conquered worlds. So while Dormammu would technically have better reality warping, Trigon undoing it, at least within his vicinity, seems just as feasible, and if this doesn’t work he can also absorb entire dimensions anyways.

BFR/Sealing: Both of them can banish opponents, seal them away, make portals, and travel interdimensionally, so any attempt to remove the other from the fight would be extremely redundant.

Forcefields: Both can make barriers to block attacks.

Illusions: Both Dormammu and Trigon are skilled illusionists, capable of fooling even the most skilled of magic users and telepaths, and both have seen through illusions in the past so these won’t work.

Possession: Neither actually resist possession here, and both are able to do it against unwilling opponents so this would cancel out.

Disintegration: Both can reduce opponents to mere ashes with a single touch.

Power Nullification: This power would probably outright fail to work on either of them for how said powers work. Dormammu’s are almost entirely magic-based, which isn’t really useful against a demonic being like Trigon, who has very little magic in his powers that he uses. Trigon's power nullification on the other hand can work on very powerful magical beings such as the Phantom Stranger, but it isn’t what it's hyped up to be. While the Phantom Stranger’s powers were being tampered with by Trigon’s realm, he was still ultimately able to use his powers, so Dormammu wouldn’t be entirely helpless in an encounter like this.

Abstract Existence: On a more conceptual level, both are embodiments of evil. Dormammu is older than the concept of time itself, and will continue to exist as long as he is worshipped by his followers. Similarly speaking, Trigon is the concept of evil personified, existing in all of humanity where there is an absence of empathy, persisting so long as his influence persists.

Unshared Powers

These are powers that one has but the other doesn’t, and we’ll go over if they are resisted or not.

Existence Erasure: Dormammu is able to erase people from existence and put people to sleep, something Trigon does not possess. Trigon is a demon, and demons such as his grandson Etrigan have resisted angelic fire, which can eradicate even the Phantom Stranger from existence, so it's feasible that Trigon can resist this ability since he’s on a comparable level of power to Etrigan.

Sleep Manipulation: Although Trigon has some physical limitations, demons do not require sleep to survive so it is also feasible for him to resist Dormammu attempting to put him to sleep.

Temporal Manipulation: As for Trigon, temporal manipulation is something Dormammu hasn’t really shown, but for how Trigon or others like Raven use it, it isn’t anything too crazy. Banishing Dormammu back in time would be inefficient given he’s willingly traveled through time before, so Dormammu should resist this ability quite easily.

Superior Versions of Shared Powers

Absorption: While both Dormammu and Trigon have vast absorption capabilities, Dormammu covers a wider array of things he can absorb. Both can absorb entire dimensions, but Dormammu can absorb an infinite amount of energy, life forces, power, magic, willpower, consciousness, and powers themselves. Trigon on the other hand can absorb basic energy and more importantly evil energy, which provides some decent counterbalance to Dormammu absorbing energy from him, though Dormammu’s versatility in this department should put him ahead of Trigon regardless.

Soul Manipulation: This one easily goes to Trigon. This is his bread and butter, his cream of the corn. While Dormammu is able to manipulate, eat, and shape souls, Trigon does so better and far more frequently. One of the biggest blows of Trigon’s siege on Earth was draining the souls of billions to empower himself, but he is also capable of affecting souls to the point where he can torture them eternally, or outright cause soul destruction, whether with hellfire or simply exploding them. One of his best feats by far is when the people of Azarath shredded Trigon’s physical form to destroy him, which backfired and allowed him to merge with the souls of Azarath itself, corrupting them in the process. If this were to work on Dormammu, things would take a turn for the worst. While Dormammu has resisted basic soul affecting from hellfire, Trigon operates on another level, and merging with Dormammu’s soul/essence would allow Trigon to overwrite his essence so his body would serve as a host for Trigon, overriding Dormammu entirely. Can Dormammu resist this?

With his experience against Doctor Strange and his astral form, Dormammu’s essence has this covered. The very core of Dormammu’s being/essence, where his evil is most concentrated, acted as a safeguard to prevent Strange’s astral form from possessing his body. However, a question arises; if Raven and Trigon are more potent soul manipulators, could this outdo Strange’s own ability to possess living beings?

In terms of named beings, Strange has possessed Adam Warlock with the Soul Stone before, though Adam was purposefully asleep and residing within the Soul Stone’s dimension, but otherwise, there aren't any notable names. Trigon has possessed Raven, who has resisted possession from Jericho before, so there is an argument to be made that Trigon could override Dormammu’s resistance, but what if Dormammu didn’t need to resist possession necessarily?

When Dormammu repelled Strange’s astral form, it was physically. He pulled away Strange’s astral form, outright acting as a defense against possession, and with Dormammu being considered stronger at every end, Dormammu can simply repel Trigon’s attempt, especially considering Dormammu’s own experience fighting against souls, with him saying he can fight physically/non-physically at the same time. On top of this, Trigon’s more…recent showings make his ways to cheat death a little trickier…

An Unlikely Wincon?

Let’s talk about matter manipulation/transmutation/biological manipulation. While this one may seem like it doesn’t matter, recent comics for both of these conquerors has made this a more interesting power interaction. Trigon was unfortunately affected by an amped Aqualad giving him a heart attack by way of blood manipulation, and Dormammu was given a physical beating heart for his body as a limitation by the Scarlet Witch. Both can turn bones into jelly, manipulate blood, turn people to stone, age people to dust, and overall manipulate matter and atoms to their whim. With both being vulnerable to heart attacks, it’s very dangerous for either to have their innards affected, and it happening to either of them could be a major setback to this fight. Trigon has far more moments of using matter manipulation to attack someone internally, and given Raven has done so to beings as powerful as the Hell Lord Neron, it's not like Trigon would be too shy of using this ability either. However, Trigon is in far more danger if he is affected by it then Dormammu despite being able to use it more. Neither have an outright ability to exploit these weaknesses however, so is having the smarts to pull it off necessary?

Regardless of who is more likely to use this however, only two to three powers really matter in the end. In terms of sheer versatility and power, they’re almost dead even, each having their own superior version of important abilities, so for abilities, this category is a draw.

Experience

When it comes to experience and skill, this one is surprisingly clear cut. In battles like these where both of them reach such levels of power, categories like these tend to be trivial, but it actually plays a crucial role in how they fight and who will make the right move first, especially with an odd amount of weaknesses on the line. 

Trigon has been a conqueror since birth, taking over his homeworld as a one year old, destroying it at six, and then taking over his entire dimension at 30, and has ruled over millions of worlds, kingdoms, and dimensions before time came to be. In battle, Trigon is quite clever and deceitful, hatching plots to take out every past and present Teen Titan despite being 1/10th of his power, or when he orchestrated an entire battle on Earth with illusions, and he is part of why Raven was enlisted into the Teen Titans, using her as a spy from the start. And naturally, he’s faced off against DC’s best to offer, such as the Justice League, Teen Titans, Justice League Dark, and even more powerful beings like Neron (though somehow he hasn’t fought Darkseid yet?). More surprisingly, he’s also a pretty competent tinkerer, making weapons such as the cosmic cannon if he’s feeling extra spiteful towards planets. 

Similarly speaking, Dormammu is also a being older than time itself as we mortals see it, and has been kicking it long enough to catch the attention of even the most powerful warriors such as Odin. He’s taken many realities by force, but lots of it is also due to his tactical mind and leadership capabilities, which has allowed him to topple over Mephisto and take his realm. Though he is mistaken for a demon, Dormammu has the cunning of one, duping super-geniuses like Reed Richards and fooling Doctor Strange into striking deals that keep him in power. Like Trigon, he’s also a schemer in the shadows, and was the one whispering into Baron Mordo’s ear to turn on the Ancient One to take the mantle of Sorcerer Supreme for himself. He’s also spent centuries dedicating his time to spell casting, incantations, and even training in hand-to-hand combat, besting Doctor Strange in a competition where neither were allowed to use spells, which is crucial since Doctor Strange has a brown belt in many martial arts taught to him by Wong. 

While it may seem like these two have been alive around the same time, Trigon has been around for far less time in terms of how old he is, as he came into existence at a time when humans abandoned Earth and went to an interdimensional realm known as Azarath, which was said to only have been hundreds of years ago. Though it's unclear, Dormammu’s age has still been described as over thousands of years old if not millions, giving him far more time and experience overall. While both are equal in scheming capabilities, the main things that set them apart are as follows; Dormammu is more of a battle tactician, while Trigon is oddly more of a tinkerer. And the other big thing is in sheer fighting skill, which Trigon is severely lacking in. When Raven was amplified by the Dark-Winged Angel, she was also given the powers of the Teen Titans, which included skill as well. In this fight, Raven pointed out that her father has probably never been in a fight against someone his own size or power level, nor faced somebody with Nightwing’s skill, and he was pretty easily dominated in the fight as a result. As pointed out, Dormammu has faced skilled martial artists like Doctor Strange, who may not be as skilled as Nightwing, but there’s enough of a gap to insinuate that Trigon has never really had formal hand-to-hand combat training at even a semi-competent level, whereas Dormammu has had centuries of this. So with his older age and more battle-hardened fiery dome, Dormammu takes experience. 

Immortality

As we’ve established, we’re dealing with embodiments of evil here. They’ve been killed many times before, only to come back bigger and badder. They’ve been around for decades and no matter how many times characters as small as the Titans or as large as Galactus defeat them, Dormammu and Trigon will always come back from death, hungry for more. Would abilities like soul hax or matter manipulation really be what ends the fight? Which of them has the superior ability to continue this battle of conquerors? To find that out, let’s talk about their immortality.

Starting with Trigon the Terrible, he has survived some harsh punishment in the past. He has been stabbed through the head and shaken it off, extended his own bones from his body and regenerated them with no effort and most impressively, had his entire body vaporized by the spirits of Azarath who couldn't destroy his energy, managing to survive via his seeds which he used to infect his daughters soul and would resurrect himself through Raven, killing her in the process while giving himself life anew. Other demons have been able to survive severe bodily harm and regenerate the injuries like his sons surviving decapitations, head stabbings and Raven performing Kano’s fatality and Etrigan survived Swamp Thing impaling him through virtually his entire body. It is worth noting that as said before, demons' regeneration can be inconsistent as seen with them being killed by injuries they previously survived with no difficulty like Bizzaro ripping out Trigon's heart or Suge dying to a decapitation. Demons are also capable of returning after they have been killed or fading away after some time passes, likely a few years since that's the time frame Raven gave for the last time she faced Trigon upon the realization he had returned to life. Some examples of their resurrection being Trigon's sons resurrecting after Etrigan killed them, Trigon reviving in his realm after he had his body and soul erased, and coming back to life after Bizzaro killed him.

As for the dreaded Dormammu, his immortality is far more simple to cover. He is an extradimensional being composed of pure energy thanks to his Faltine physiology. Being made of energy gives Dormammu the ability to alter his form as he so chooses being able to mold his body to create new limbs, other things like wings, remove these additions with no issue and take severe punishment like regrowing his arm in moments in his battle with Wanda and Clea, stating that matter is just a suit he wears which can be easily restored while he repairs damage to his hand. Dormammu beyond just being composed of energy is also a concept and shared belief, who can always return to life, as energy will form to become him within a few hours as long as other beings worship him, feeding off of evil and sin. Dormammu also possesses a core where most of his evil is concentrated within his soul. This core was able to protect Dormammu from Doctor Strange's astral form making attacking his essence even more challenging. 

When it comes down to it, both Dormammu and Trigon’s capabilities to come back from serious harm are both exceptional; however, only one of them truly has the means to keep going in this fight. Despite Trigon having more direct showings for how much damage he can regenerate and come back from, he is shown to have his limits. As we have seen, demons' immortality is not perfect and sufficient physical damage can leave them helpless, something that is mostly foreign to Dormammu whose body is pure energy and suffers no such drawbacks. While Dormammu recently was given a heart that was a very large weakness for him, the same can be said for Trigon who has even more showings of the heart being a weak point for him and even demons as a whole. 

Even if we take Trigon’s regeneration at its peak and consider the Bizzaro example as well as the others like his sons battles with Etrigan as outliers, it still doesn't quite match up to Dormammu being able to alter his form at will and shed it however he sees fit. His Faltine physiology gives him much more room for error, not needing a physical body to keep on fighting or maintain shape, whereas Trigon doesn't have as much leeway and if a truly devastating attack was landed, he would be pretty heavily compromised. And while both embody ideas and concepts, allowing them to always rematerialize and come back from defeat, Dormammu’s resurrection is clearly better. The given timeframe for him to come back was a few hours by his own admission meanwhile the given timeframe for Trigon is somewhere around a few years, making Dormammu’s resurrection far more combat applicable than his opponents. Had these limitations never happened before, Trigon very likely could’ve netted a win in some circumstances. 

But what about Trigon’s seeds? The seeds are Trigon himself and if he manages to infect Dormammu with one wont he be able to take over Dormammu’s body, outlasting and eventually killing him? While that is a possible outcome as discussed previously, we feel that it would only delay Trigon’s defeat. It can keep him in the fight longer and maybe net a win but it's unlikely given Dormammu’s physiology, specifically the core protecting his essence from such possession attempts from the likes of Doctor Strange, which can act as a defense that is likely amplified further if you buy Dormammu being more powerful. And with Dormammu’s own experience in combat, he can keep fighting for a long time and sustain himself with power, all the while Trigon has to try and play catch up with more bodies that all start out weaker. Both combatants were difficult to put down but Dormammu ultimately emerges as the more unkillable Hell Lord, taking the final category in this matchup.

Conclusion

“Know me--For I am Dormammu! He who comes from the outer dark! He who has waited eternities to possess your frail universe! Look upon my visage and know fear! Hear my words in your soul and feel it crumble! I scream blood and murder at your weak stars! And my screams are the armies of Hell!”

Advantages:

• Takes the strength advantage no matter what end you use

• Black Dechantment grants him far greater attack range with the Dark Dimension

• Cancels out in most abilities such as cosmic senses and BFR

• More versatile ways of absorbing energy, always ensuring he has power

• Matter manipulation could severely cripple Trigon in the fight

• Far more experienced and skilled

• Superior immortality and faster resurrection

• If he loses his physical body, can still persist fighting on as an energy being or even a soul

• Umar is a viable support…

• Is a DnD fan

• He’s really fun to play in UMvC3 icl

Disadvantages:

• Inferior soul manipulating abilities

• If Trigon were to pull off his soul merging/corruption, Dormammu would die

• Cannot erase Trigon or put him to sleep

• Trigon can easily counter reality warping with his own absorption

• …But she isn’t the most loyal twin sister

• We went through this whole blog without making a single “I’ve come to bargain” reference-

“In seeking to eradicate my evil... You have made me supreme! I am now power. I am now death. I am now TRIGON!“

Advantages:

• Superior soul manipulation abilities

• Merging with Dormammu’s soul could very well end the fight for Dormammu

• Cancels out in most abilities such as mind manipulation/illusions

• Matter manipulation could affect Dormammu…

• Energy absorption could offset having his own energy absorbed

• Resists being erased and put to sleep due to demon physiology

• Can regenerate his body from more basic attacks 

• The living flesh cancel out with the Mindless Ones

• Teen Titans and Justice League Dark: Apokolips War

• Wins the twerk off

Disadvantages:

• Less powerful no matter what end you buy

• Far less experienced and skilled

• …But it wouldn’t matter in the long run due to Dormammu’s regeneration and immortality

• Immortality has its limits and his resurrection takes time

• Trigon seeds will likely only delay the inevitable 

• Is a fan of Loonatics Unleashed

• It’s not that bad

• At least half of his comics are cameo flashbacks

• Jobbed to Bizarro (loser lmao)

This was a surprisingly tricky fight to figure out, especially with how much modern comics threw a monkey wrench into the picture. But in the end, Dormammu has more going for him in terms of ending the fight. He has the strength necessary to overpower Trigon physically no matter what end you go with, and that gives him an easier time pulling off more of his abilities.

He has more ways to enhance himself by absorbing dimensions and all forms of energy, and while Trigon can tug at this process, Dormammu has more room for error if something were to go wrong. Trigon’s best bet is to use his soul merging to affect Dormammu, but Dormammu’s defenses against possession and experience against battles on the body/spirit simultaneously gives him the edge he needs to win the fight. Trigon was only able to do this after his body was destroyed, but with the current comic status quo, this is likely not the route Trigon wants to take, as sufficient bloodbending is enough to take him out of the fight. Sure, Trigon seeds give him some retries, but Dormammu’s experience and fighting means he’ll be able to continue to fight on just as long until he gets the job done, of which he is more than capable of doing against weaker bodies of Trigon trying to manifest.

Dormammu’s Faltine physiology also gives him more room for error if he were to be affected by matter manipulation, letting him shape his body and persist on without needing a physical mask to wear, letting him stay in the fight and treating the loss of his body as nothing more than a minor inconvenience at best. Whereas if Trigon were to be killed sufficiently, it would take him years to come back to life, which in Death Battle, is far too long for Trigon to still be “in the fight”, thus giving Dormammu the win. While Trigon had a terrifying demon-stration of power, Dormammu gave him a dimensional downgrade.

The winner is the Dreaded Dormammu.

Final Tally

Dormammu (16)- Bang, Rina Antiqua, Tru, Yerm, The Cardinal King, Gio, Joshski, Frenchhoaxide, Riley, Stationsearcher, Coach Boomer, Pasbros, Blessedaura, Yuix, Restaurant_Worried, AgentRedhead

Trigon (0)-

Next Time…